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Problem with PU community
https://www.pick-up-artist-forum.com/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=27744		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  MSmith19 [ Fri Sep 05, 2008 6:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Problem with PU community
I think that too much emphasis is placed on what you say, rather than you subcommunication or HOW you present what you have to say. I am sure that many of you are familiar with the idea that what you say is actually only ~7% of your total communication. This leaves 93% to tone of voice, body language and congruency.

And yet, people still focus a majority of their time creating new openers, putting together and memorizing routines and trying to dissect every single sentence that a girl says to you, or that you say to this girl. Instead, more focus should be placed on inner game, developing a strong, congruent identity, powerful bodylanguage and vocal tone and pitch.

Have you ever noticed that when a girl is into you, you can say just about anything and she'll either laugh or respond to it well. When you are speaking from outside of your head, and naturally- instead of these canned openers and routines, it can be seen in your body language. Women pick up on this. If anyone wants to learn more about subcommunication and its importance, along with a more natural game where you don't need to reframe everything, change your attitudes, and rearrange your whole life to somebody you aren't, you should check out Real Social Dynamics by Tyler Durden. I am still only a ways through the audio, but I am becoming more and more of a fan of his viewpoint on pickup and overall social ability.
Author:  Solomon II [ Fri Sep 05, 2008 6:42 pm ]
Post subject: 
Exactly. People hold too much value in the words and keeping the conversation going; they worry about running out of things to say instead of focusing on the really important stuff. And sadly, when we tell them about the importance of subcommunication, all they do is ask the same question to someone else because they didn't hear what they wanted to.
Author:  8Bit [ Fri Sep 05, 2008 6:48 pm ]
Post subject: 
I'll be honest, I started canned, and then went back to my previous personality in a way, but thousands of times better! I'm now a funnier version, with a few successful lines. I get better success than with routines, in my opinion because they sense an actor. We're not all trained to be someone else, so introducing that bit of the real you really helps. I'm gonna check out RSD if I can get hold of it, but yeah, great post. Pickup needs to change to not be a robot factory. If I see people using lines, I simply use my own prepared lines to fight back. Its only a matter of time before HB's will become capable of doing this to, as more and more are reaching for the game off the bookshelf. What if I wrote a book.....the girls guide to pickup artist combat! Nah, joking. Many girls still deny it even exists, and believe PU is simply corny lines from 50 years ago, but the risk is still getting higher that they might recognize a routine.

In summary, I totally agree. Pickup is about not only getting the girls, but changing to get them, and bettering your own social code. If your just using lines, and then switching back, its obvious.

8Bit
Author:  fsidontknow [ Fri Sep 05, 2008 8:20 pm ]
Post subject: 
then give us some posts about how to improve our subcommunication
Author:  Romeo7 [ Fri Sep 05, 2008 8:32 pm ]
Post subject: 
Give me a line. Give me a post to improve. Give it to me! :cry: You like things explained, don't you?
I'm a bit tired that everyone is focusing on communication. Communication, communication, communication! They want to communicate well with a girl, and they don't know how to communicate with themselves!
Listen, the problem is not communication. The problem is identification. When you learn to identify with someone, you can say a great deal without saying very much. On the other hand, if you don't identify with that person, you can too many words and still part away like strangers.
Think about the times you've actually become friends with someone or met a girl and ended up in a good relationship. Was it communication or was it identification?
Author:  MSmith19 [ Fri Sep 05, 2008 10:09 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
then give us some posts about how to improve our subcommunication
If I was finished learning up on this..maybe I would. The point I was making is that often subcommunication, your identity and personality are far more important that your canned lines.

To see the difference, just look at this situation:

If you see some guy with no confidence, poor body language and a weak voice and frame present to a group one of these lines that are consistently posted here..you will see them fail miserably. Next, give that line to a confident, outgoing, self-assured guy who doesn't care what people think of him. Even if he completely FUCKS up the line, more often than not, it will still be successful. Was it the words or the presentation/individual that determined the response?
Author:  Lucius [ Fri Sep 05, 2008 10:34 pm ]
Post subject: 
Yeah you guys are right, but you need canned material to start, the reason why people have AA and cant continue convo is because they dont know what to say or run out of things to say. 90% of the convo is usually done by the person who approaches until the other person gets comfortable enough to open up and keep the convo going.

Once you get good with male to female interactions you wont need canned material cuz you will have more outgoing personallity and experience.
Author:  jsquared [ Fri Sep 05, 2008 11:05 pm ]
Post subject: 
Smith the fact of the matter is most of the guys that get into this have large chunks of self-confidence missing. Canned-material is a good way to gain confidence back. Also, body language and tonality are all things that must be calibrated. Thats where canned-material also comes in as practice. You can't just read shit on body language and tonality and go practice it. You have to go in field and through trial/error begin to calibrate the way you present yourself. I personally don't use canned material, but would still advocate it to someone who is just learning to socialize with women. Tyler is the same way, he teachs people a base of canned-material and for more advanced learning a natural approach. You can't just go natural if you don't have the frame.
Author:  callmecaptain [ Sat Sep 06, 2008 12:12 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
Have you ever noticed that when a girl is into you, you can say just about anything and she'll either laugh or respond to it well.
Well said man.

Recently I've started to pick up on this myself. I think there's definately value in the canned stuff because they teach a sort of theory or pattern. Once you understand it (which I am still in the process of) then you can internalize it and customize it so it's 100% you. I'd say this is the difference between learning game and memorizing game.

I do however think that there is a lot of benefit in reframing. Any guy that can take rejection and reframe it into a smooth transition where he owns the conversation and state of mind can improve his game and save face often. It reminds me of a book I once read by Edwin Leferve on buying and selling stock. "It's not about picking winners or losers. It's about letting your winners run and cutting your losers when you identify them."

CPT
Author:  Dempsey [ Sat Sep 06, 2008 1:12 am ]
Post subject: 
This is interesting.

I started out with canned stuff to be honest, had some successes here and there...but was never really at ease.

I looked back on my previous personality and decided i was already pretty damned good...infact i had more success.

Now i just incorporate what i learn now with my personality.

Sometimes i'll be funny, sometimes i'll be serious...

It's hard to explain but i pretty much go with the flow while SEMI consciously implanting bits of game here and there. :wink:
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