PUA Forum :: Theoretically: 'Fractionating' alpha behavior?

every time I first came off as an asshole to a girl and then reframed into someone genuinely nice, it was just that much better

Yes, I really am an asshole. Will you be my friend?

"Hi, Im Beschatten and I mustered up the courage to come up and say "hi, how are you?" *Stick out your hand all shakey to shake hands while looking at the ground kicking your feet around*

I understand where you are going to, but I don't think it would work. You only get to give one first impression, so don't screw it up.. intentionally!

In many cases you will not even get a chance to build your alpha frame as you will be dropped almost instantly.

Quote:

Not necesserially. A first impression isnt instant as most people think. It varies from person to peron but generally it takes about 12 seconds (i think) of interaction to form. Now, assuming you start AFC and then shock change you will instantly draw all her attention to you, simple because you have done something NO1 has ever done before..... what i cant predict is how women will react to this shock

Author:	David~ [ Tue Jul 22, 2008 3:43 am ]
Post subject:	Theoretically: 'Fractionating' alpha behavior?
I want to take opening to a new level. And I would like feedback before I field test it and if isn't worthy then there's no need to make myself look like an ass and waste my time. The idea of 'fractionating' human behaviors. I want to know if it's possibly to make alpha traits much more attractive by first approaching in a complete AFC++like way. Presenting yourself in such a unconfident and pathetic way that the only reason the HB is going to respond is out of sympathy. Then you immediately re-frame into alpha and have tight game. This would theoretically make you more attractive to her. I mean it should make it that much better. When I think about it, every time I first came off as an asshole to a girl and then reframed into someone genuinely nice, it was just that much better for her and she appreciated it that much more. If you could do this in approach with AFC behavior, reframe to alpha to build attraction, proceed to the hook, rapport, AFC, more rapport and alpha, then close the approach with a number or a kiss. Opening like an AFC and reframing to alpha could also not work because you won't have the value to make it believable. So you could also approach alpha, reframe to complete AFC, then reframe to alpha again to blow her fucking mind away. If this is possible, and works, then you could fractionate everything, including sex. It's almost a bigger picture of push/pull. The goal is too keep your game hidden, and slowly reveal it inbetween pathetic AFC behavior. This would make the end result, you the PUA, more desirable to the target, hypothetically. This process should take place from opening until you fuck her brains out. The goal would be to end the approach on alpha terms since that will be the last thing she remembers. End result = more desirable? I dunno though, I'm going to Field test it and work out the kinks.

Author:	Infamous110 [ Tue Jul 22, 2008 3:53 am ]
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I like that you have various threads like this and seem to enjoy thinking about things and trying to break them down to improve what you already know. Potential future PUA author?! Quote: every time I first came off as an asshole to a girl and then reframed into someone genuinely nice, it was just that much better i dunno how far to take the asshole thing - from reading your posts i could see it being very literal, but what you definitely show is that you're in full control of your reality. Dominance, again, being the attractive trait. For that reason, I'm behind this. AFC first? her first impression being behaviour that she's (likely) fully versed in hearing, dealing with and rejecting, I'm not sure whether it could work the way you hope. Unless you're planning on throwing a curveball-superneg-dhv-upercut when she tries to brush off your chumpish behaviour? I guess I see this being something along the lines of: A - Excuse me. Can I ask you a question please? (it hurts to type it) B - Well, I'm kinda busy... A - You think I care? Listen, you're cute ect ect

Author:	David~ [ Tue Jul 22, 2008 4:14 am ]
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I was more thinking more AFC. I'm talking you DLV so badly that everything you do from that point on can only be taken as DHV. "Hi, Im Beschatten and I mustered up the courage to come up and say "hi, how are you?" Stick out your hand all shakey to shake hands while looking at the ground kicking your feet around And as HB plans to reject, you reframe, "great now that we met..." DHV + attraction switches get turned on. Then back to AFC/repeat. You could also expand this idea to train women. I'll get more into that later.

Author:	David~ [ Tue Jul 22, 2008 7:58 am ]
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Yes, I really am an asshole. Will you be my friend?

Author:	madals [ Tue Jul 22, 2008 12:08 pm ]
Post subject:
Quote: Yes, I really am an asshole. Will you be my friend? Homosexual pickup line of the year? I think so!!! Back to topic tho, i could see this working... implimenting it though would requaire some practice. You could use the AFC open in a C&F mentality and just play it off as a joke. Otherwise the order in which you do things would need to just be field tested, i dont think we can work this out in theory. However, the major danger of using a AFC open is if u hold for even a fraction to long, thats gonna be the first impression. Another thing i could see going very wrong is to many switches between AFC/alpha. For a start, unless its clearly a joke this will either make the target think u have split personalitys or more likly make her question ur inner game. Now talking from experience i know a guy who does this switching a hell of a lot. Its not concious but rather he is majorly lacking self confidence, so much so that it gets to a point where he thinks of himself so low on the scale basically he thinks "fuck it" and therefore acts alpha..... untill there is a rest out of the spotlight caused by this sudden attention. Needless to say, grls dont find that attractive. Btw, this topic has really pissed me off!!! Cos of my injury i have way to much time on my hands and now i have something to think about Being some what smart and all i will now not stop until i work it out to perfection..... my head is gonna hurt haha. /madals p.s although my reply seems very negative and showing potention problems to your idea, i think its a very good one. However the reason i choose to highlight problems now rather than what i can currently see to improve is because this is ur idea and i believe your personality is similar to mine, u problem solve and therefore by highlighting problems in ur plan u will work out how to fix them better ofc, correct me if i am wrong on this and u dont like the critism

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Author:	David~ [ Tue Jul 22, 2008 7:46 pm ]
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I'm field testing it tonight.

Author:	Simpua [ Tue Jul 22, 2008 8:06 pm ]
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Very interesting idea. Post how the field testing for this goes! It's similar to the situation where a HB is being hit on by a complete AFC and then Mr. Alpha comes over and 'saves her' from him.... only you play the part of both AFC and Mr. Alpha.

Author:	Killians [ Wed Jul 23, 2008 2:19 pm ]
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Quote: "Hi, Im Beschatten and I mustered up the courage to come up and say "hi, how are you?" Stick out your hand all shakey to shake hands while looking at the ground kicking your feet around That could easily get you blown out of set within the first 15 seconds. I am curious to see how it works though...

Author:	madals [ Wed Jul 23, 2008 2:27 pm ]
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I think it will be if u can hold it.... If u can avoide getting blown out within the first sentance it will be amazing. However, how to not get blown out will be hard.

Author:	Diaz [ Wed Jul 23, 2008 2:54 pm ]
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I understand where you are going to, but I don't think it would work. You only get to give one first impression, so don't screw it up.. intentionally! In many cases you will not even get a chance to build your alpha frame as you will be dropped almost instantly.

Author:	madals [ Wed Jul 23, 2008 3:02 pm ]
Post subject:
Quote: I understand where you are going to, but I don't think it would work. You only get to give one first impression, so don't screw it up.. intentionally! In many cases you will not even get a chance to build your alpha frame as you will be dropped almost instantly. Not necesserially. A first impression isnt instant as most people think. It varies from person to peron but generally it takes about 12 seconds (i think) of interaction to form. Now, assuming you start AFC and then shock change you will instantly draw all her attention to you, simple because you have done something NO1 has ever done before..... what i cant predict is how women will react to this shock

Author:	Cloak&Swagger [ Wed Jul 23, 2008 3:30 pm ]
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What's the point though? There's no need to hide your game, unless you give off sleazy player vibes which is something you need to address if you do. I guess it could provide a contrast for her, but she will already be contrasting you with all the AFCs that have approached her in the past. I think it would only succeed in making the girl think you're crazy, personally.

Author:	BetaMale [ Wed Jul 23, 2008 3:57 pm ]
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Quote: Quote: I understand where you are going to, but I don't think it would work. You only get to give one first impression, so don't screw it up.. intentionally! In many cases you will not even get a chance to build your alpha frame as you will be dropped almost instantly. Not necesserially. A first impression isnt instant as most people think. It varies from person to peron but generally it takes about 12 seconds (i think) of interaction to form. Now, assuming you start AFC and then shock change you will instantly draw all her attention to you, simple because you have done something NO1 has ever done before..... what i cant predict is how women will react to this shock I agree that first impressions are crucial and difficult to change (Blink and Sway are two great books that go into detail about this). According to these books, people will ignore new information that is contrary to their first impression. So if you start as an AFC, they will filter your PUA moves as AFC anyway. BUT my gut tells me that this is actually a brilliant idea. I've noticed in the field that different women give wildly different responses even to the same opener in the same situation. So I think that some chicks will not be receptive at first, but thats OK because you can "turn it on" when you want. The ones that are polite you will be able to pleasantly surprise with tight game. I look forward to hearing how this pans out.

Author:	Killians [ Wed Jul 23, 2008 4:40 pm ]
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I forgot to add...since you aren't being consistent with your behaviors you might come off as untrustworthy/suspicious etc

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Author:	David~ [ Wed Jul 23, 2008 7:39 pm ]
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The point of doing this is to blow her fucking mind away. If you can fractionate human emotions, why not behaviors? If you can fractionate behaviors then you do just about anything. The female will constantly be on edge and will not know what to expect. This will create a spontaneous effect that keeps her hooked, and everytime you re-frame what you do will be greatly appreciated. I'm still field testing SPAM. You will all get the overall report soon.