PUA Forum :: Self-disqualification?

Self-disqualification is one technique that works great on field from answering those girlie qualifiers like, "What's your job?" "What school did you go to?" or "Do you have a girlfriend?". I think self-disqualification is a fundamental PUA staple that separates the AFC from the seducer.

In your case, however, I think what worked so well that made you get the girls into a very sexual state with you is that you made them feel good first (with a laugh) and then you escalated the sexual innuendo ad infinitum.

When you get so good at that pattern, girls will actually make the move to isolate with you to your bedroom without much effort from your part. You just ride the flow.

It's one of those field realities that doesn't get taught around here. You'll notice though that once you make a girl or set of girls feel good, you can lead them to a very sexual state for hours. All you've got to do is have some balls and not give a fuck what happens next.

The key here is that girls don't even need to be attracted to you at all. Just get them to think sexual thoughts in your presence and, bam, when you get them so horny enough, you f-close.

I've been thinking about how to apply this in a pickup situation and the line I've come up with to encapsulate this is:

"Relax ladies, I don't expect any of you to come home with a dork like me"

I think if spoken in a cheerful and confident way, that could totally open up their state in a way that no amount of DHVing could do. It makes clear that I'm viewing them sexually, but completely lets them off the hook as to their response. It also plays into the female desire to help and improve a man. Maybe they don't think I'm a dork. Maybe they actually think I look pretty shaggable. And maybe they just want to spend some time convincing me of that fact.

Quote:

Again, in right context, with the right delivery and at the right time, this can work. However, I would just say that perhaps personality traits such as "dork" aren't going to work as well as making a joke out of your looks. As I mentioned above, a lot of it is about the self depreciating line not actually being self depreciating.

If a girl can see you're decent looking, then she is obviously not going to think you're actually ugly, even if you're making jokes about it. However, if you call yourself a dork as an opener, she doesn't know you, she might just think "ok, why is he saying that?" I would leave lines like that until a lot later on. I've once joked about me being boring to a girl I'd already slept with a couple of times and she said "oh I definitely don't think you're boring" and started listing off reasons! But had I said that the first time we met, she'd probably have been thinking "oh, is he boring then?"

Could you please give examples of how you would answer these questions using self-disqualification?

I've observed that guys who are generally considered sexy tend to have a feminine side or element to them (Russell Brand and Prince come to mind), and an ability to transcend their prescribed gender role. I think Chief made a post about dissolving the ego, but the link between this and embracing the feminine wasn't really covered. After all, isn't being egotistical a largely male problem? And I'm guessing this comes across in how most men approach women. It's all about what they have, what they can do, trying to impress women in the way that they would try to impress men by trying to quantify themselves and evaluate themselves based on that.

No man naturally wants to stand up and slay his ego in front of others, and that's why I'm thinking it could be such a powerful thing to do, both for you and for women. How many men take this approach and how refreshing must it be?

I read an article by Tyler recently about the "Secret Society" and it sounded like bullshit to me, but if there is such a thing, surely it must be a place where you leave your ego at the door. If women are ever going to consider you "the exception to the rule" it's because you just smash your own ego right there in front of them.

As I've said, when I made this comment, I felt like I was in exciting new territory, and I felt like they were there with me. I had made myself non-threatening by showing that I was willing to neg myself before they even thought of doing it. I felt like this created a new openness in them. It was just a different experience.

"Relax ladies, I don't expect any of you to come home with a dork like me"

Quote:

"Relax ladies, I don't expect any of you to come home with a dork like me"

With your personality, I think that will work for you in field. All you have to do is validate it. With someone like bartm or Paramount, I think the result would be a disaster.

Author:	Don Horneone [ Mon Dec 09, 2013 11:28 pm ]
Post subject:	Self-disqualification?
Early on at work this morning, one of my female colleagues was talking about a comment we'd made the previous week about her not being subtle and apparently she'd been dwelling on it a lot, to the point of asking her mother whether she was subtle. Apparently her mother said she was. At which point I responded: "Yeah, and MY mother thinks I'm HANDSOME" I'm not sure where the remark came from but both my female colleagues laughed and unsubtle woman continued with the theme, saying that my Mum thought I could pull Claudia Schiffer. I said that my Mum thought I would have to turn Claudia Schiffer down as I would be too good for her. It was a curious frame to the conversation. I started off by implying that I wasn't attractive almost as if it was an obvious understood fact, and yet we somehow ended up implying I was too good for Claudia Schiffer. I didn't think through this comment consciously at all, I just made it, but I felt like I'd done something powerful. I felt like I'd truly shown I didn't give a fuck what these women thought of me by implying that I wasn't attractive and acting like I wouldn't care if this was true. Reflecting on the rest of the day's interactions, at one point I took my jumper off and unsubtle woman said "steady on", clearly trying to sexualise the situation. I made a comment about how she should try to concentrate on her work and she played along with it. Somehow it even ended up being implied that my MALE colleague was being distracted by my attractiveness. Interestingly, said male colleague a bit later took of HIS jumper and made a comment about "stripping off". Unsubtle woman's response was "is that strictly necessary?". Towards the end of the day my other female colleague was saying something vaguely directed at me which I didn't quite catch but I deliberately misheard it and said "WHO'S giving me a lapdance?". They both laughed again and the other woman, instead of trying to knock me back or act above it, said that there wouldn't be much point me getting a lapdance from her as her tits weren't big enough. I've never been the kind of guy to get woman being so cool with me being sexual with them like that, I'm just getting used to it, but I can't help feeling that my blatant self-disqualification shot up my social value and actually made me seem more attractive to them. On a similar note, this colleague I mentioned who talked about her tits frequently makes comments about them being too small and acts like she's not bothered about it (similar self-disqualification), and it's never made me less attracted to her. If anything it makes me more so. So has anyone employed this as a strategy, going up to a group of hot girls and matter-of-factly implying that they wouldn't be interested in him but not acting at all bothered by that? Seems to me like it might have a pretty powerful effect.

Author:	Monsignor Crisanto [ Tue Dec 10, 2013 12:44 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Self-disqualification?
Self-disqualification is one technique that works great on field from answering those girlie qualifiers like, "What's your job?" "What school did you go to?" or "Do you have a girlfriend?". I think self-disqualification is a fundamental PUA staple that separates the AFC from the seducer. In your case, however, I think what worked so well that made you get the girls into a very sexual state with you is that you made them feel good first (with a laugh) and then you escalated the sexual innuendo ad infinitum. When you get so good at that pattern, girls will actually make the move to isolate with you to your bedroom without much effort from your part. You just ride the flow. It's one of those field realities that doesn't get taught around here. You'll notice though that once you make a girl or set of girls feel good, you can lead them to a very sexual state for hours. All you've got to do is have some balls and not give a fuck what happens next. The key here is that girls don't even need to be attracted to you at all. Just get them to think sexual thoughts in your presence and, bam, when you get them so horny enough, you f-close.

Author:	Don Horneone [ Tue Dec 10, 2013 7:12 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Self-disqualification?
Quote: Self-disqualification is one technique that works great on field from answering those girlie qualifiers like, "What's your job?" "What school did you go to?" or "Do you have a girlfriend?". I think self-disqualification is a fundamental PUA staple that separates the AFC from the seducer. Could you please give examples of how you would answer these questions using self-disqualification? Quote: In your case, however, I think what worked so well that made you get the girls into a very sexual state with you is that you made them feel good first (with a laugh) and then you escalated the sexual innuendo ad infinitum. When you get so good at that pattern, girls will actually make the move to isolate with you to your bedroom without much effort from your part. You just ride the flow. It's one of those field realities that doesn't get taught around here. You'll notice though that once you make a girl or set of girls feel good, you can lead them to a very sexual state for hours. All you've got to do is have some balls and not give a fuck what happens next. The key here is that girls don't even need to be attracted to you at all. Just get them to think sexual thoughts in your presence and, bam, when you get them so horny enough, you f-close. I have some further thoughts on this. Re-reading my post (which I wrote while drunk late last night), it occurs to me that I didn't just make a good impression by making this initial comment, I did something as important which was to liberate myself. By being completely open about not needing to be anything in particular, I became free to be myself and to feel good (a state which transferred as you observed) and to "escalate the sexual innuendo". So maybe this comment about not being handsome did as much good for me as it did for them. I've observed that guys who are generally considered sexy tend to have a feminine side or element to them (Russell Brand and Prince come to mind), and an ability to transcend their prescribed gender role. I think Chief made a post about dissolving the ego, but the link between this and embracing the feminine wasn't really covered. After all, isn't being egotistical a largely male problem? And I'm guessing this comes across in how most men approach women. It's all about what they have, what they can do, trying to impress women in the way that they would try to impress men by trying to quantify themselves and evaluate themselves based on that. No man naturally wants to stand up and slay his ego in front of others, and that's why I'm thinking it could be such a powerful thing to do, both for you and for women. How many men take this approach and how refreshing must it be? I read an article by Tyler recently about the "Secret Society" and it sounded like bullshit to me, but if there is such a thing, surely it must be a place where you leave your ego at the door. If women are ever going to consider you "the exception to the rule" it's because you just smash your own ego right there in front of them. Trying to see things from a female point of view, it seems to me that the male ego must be the bane of their life. It's what keeps guys pursuing them beyond the point where they're obviously not interested. It's what makes guys react in anger or even violence when they're rejected. It's what makes it necessary for women to tiptoe and pussyfoot around men because once the ego is wounded, who knows what she's going to get? As I've said, when I made this comment, I felt like I was in exciting new territory, and I felt like they were there with me. I had made myself non-threatening by showing that I was willing to neg myself before they even thought of doing it. I felt like this created a new openness in them. It was just a different experience. I've been thinking about how to apply this in a pickup situation and the line I've come up with to encapsulate this is: "Relax ladies, I don't expect any of you to come home with a dork like me" I think if spoken in a cheerful and confident way, that could totally open up their state in a way that no amount of DHVing could do. It makes clear that I'm viewing them sexually, but completely lets them off the hook as to their response. It also plays into the female desire to help and improve a man. Maybe they don't think I'm a dork. Maybe they actually think I look pretty shaggable. And maybe they just want to spend some time convincing me of that fact.

Author:	7000 [ Thu Dec 12, 2013 1:11 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Self-disqualification?
Firstly Cliff, I note you are in England. Now I'm not normally one for making a big deal out of geographical differences, but in England we do seem to have a lot more of a sarcastic self depreciating sense of humour anyway. I'm not going to make too many sweeping generalisations here, but I think often over here you're better off actually downplaying some of the more overt confidence, a bit of humility and sarcastic confidence as you've shown here probably works better a lot of the time. Secondly, your self depreciating humour isn't really self depreciating. You said your mum thinks your handsome but you weren't really genuinely implying that you think you're ugly and at least your mum thinks you're not. It was just a bit of sarcastic humour. If you said the same thing in a mopey tone in a different context, it wouldn't be attractive at all! In fact, saying things like you did there show that you're actually very comfortable with yourself - do you think someone who was very self conscious about their looks would be making such jokes? Do you think the girl with small tits you mention would be talking about them in the same way if she was actually a nervous wreck? If she was genuinely she'd be talking about them in a more negative or matter of fact way. She mentioned her small tits in a jokey matter. She's suggesting that "society says" small tits are bad and that "small tits = bad lapdance" but really she doesn't care. As long as you deliver "self depreciating" humour properly, it actually comes across as very confident. And to make a bit of a bridge from what Hellhound is talking about (which I agree with in its entirety by the way) - the self depriciating sort of comment you made (about your own looks) is actually a great way to get into that sort of sexual innuendo type tone. Because you're jokily talking about looks, that can easily go into sexual situations such as the claudia schiffer one you've discussed. And, as Hellhound points out, when you've got the girl into that sort of tone and she's comfortable with it, it's easy to keep it going and make jokes like the lapdance one you did here. I think it also helps that the initial comment you made was "soft sexual". Had you jumped straight in with a lapdance joke or whatever, it may not have gone down too well. But talking about looks and joking in a self depreciating manner about being able to pull women has set you up perfectly.

Author:	7000 [ Thu Dec 12, 2013 1:18 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Self-disqualification?
Quote: I've been thinking about how to apply this in a pickup situation and the line I've come up with to encapsulate this is: "Relax ladies, I don't expect any of you to come home with a dork like me" I think if spoken in a cheerful and confident way, that could totally open up their state in a way that no amount of DHVing could do. It makes clear that I'm viewing them sexually, but completely lets them off the hook as to their response. It also plays into the female desire to help and improve a man. Maybe they don't think I'm a dork. Maybe they actually think I look pretty shaggable. And maybe they just want to spend some time convincing me of that fact. Again, in right context, with the right delivery and at the right time, this can work. However, I would just say that perhaps personality traits such as "dork" aren't going to work as well as making a joke out of your looks. As I mentioned above, a lot of it is about the self depreciating line not actually being self depreciating. If a girl can see you're decent looking, then she is obviously not going to think you're actually ugly, even if you're making jokes about it. However, if you call yourself a dork as an opener, she doesn't know you, she might just think "ok, why is he saying that?" I would leave lines like that until a lot later on. I've once joked about me being boring to a girl I'd already slept with a couple of times and she said "oh I definitely don't think you're boring" and started listing off reasons! But had I said that the first time we met, she'd probably have been thinking "oh, is he boring then?"

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Author:	Don Horneone [ Thu Dec 12, 2013 9:26 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Self-disqualification?
Quote: Quote: I've been thinking about how to apply this in a pickup situation and the line I've come up with to encapsulate this is: "Relax ladies, I don't expect any of you to come home with a dork like me" I think if spoken in a cheerful and confident way, that could totally open up their state in a way that no amount of DHVing could do. It makes clear that I'm viewing them sexually, but completely lets them off the hook as to their response. It also plays into the female desire to help and improve a man. Maybe they don't think I'm a dork. Maybe they actually think I look pretty shaggable. And maybe they just want to spend some time convincing me of that fact. Again, in right context, with the right delivery and at the right time, this can work. However, I would just say that perhaps personality traits such as "dork" aren't going to work as well as making a joke out of your looks. As I mentioned above, a lot of it is about the self depreciating line not actually being self depreciating. If a girl can see you're decent looking, then she is obviously not going to think you're actually ugly, even if you're making jokes about it. However, if you call yourself a dork as an opener, she doesn't know you, she might just think "ok, why is he saying that?" I would leave lines like that until a lot later on. I've once joked about me being boring to a girl I'd already slept with a couple of times and she said "oh I definitely don't think you're boring" and started listing off reasons! But had I said that the first time we met, she'd probably have been thinking "oh, is he boring then?" I take your point on board, you have to prove you're NOT something before you can joke about it

Author:	Monsignor Crisanto [ Sat Dec 14, 2013 2:02 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Self-disqualification?
Quote: Could you please give examples of how you would answer these questions using self-disqualification? What's your job? Pre-PUA, I used to answer this as neutrally as possible. With men, the reaction was pretty normal. I get probing questions where other men find a common ground that they can relate with. For example: New Guy: So what do you do? Me: I'm a project manager for a systems integrator. I also package projects and market them. So how long have you been in politics? New Guy: Our family is involved in politics for quite a long time. What exactly is system integration? Me: Well, it's like golf. Do you play golf? With women, the reaction is pretty negative. Woman: So what do you do? Me: I'm a project manager for a systems integrator. I also package projects and market them. So how's it going with the medical association? I've heard you just won the election. You're treasurer is this correct? Woman: (Whispers: Braggart.) Actually I was treasurer last year. This year, I'm vice president. Me: Cool. So your term is for 6 years? You must have a very busy schedule. How do you keep up? Deep into PUA, whether I'm sarging girls or not I answer this way: Woman: So what do you do? Me: I'm a funeral singer. The pay is good. I get paid one buck per song. Do you want to hear a sample? Woman: (Laughs out loud and play punches my arm.) You must be kidding... Woman: So what do you do? Me: I'm a crocodile farmer. I raise crocodile scrotums for an Italian restaurant. We have a vacancy for a shooter. The perks are great. You get free insurance. If you lost one finger, you get paid 500 bucks. If you lost an entire hand, you get paid one thousand bucks. Woman: (Laughs out loud and play punches my arm.) No, seriously. What do you do? Me: I can show you my crocodiles, if you like... Some have big balls like this but their cocks are even bigger like this. By the way, do you prefer big cocks or small cocks? Quote: I've observed that guys who are generally considered sexy tend to have a feminine side or element to them (Russell Brand and Prince come to mind), and an ability to transcend their prescribed gender role. I think Chief made a post about dissolving the ego, but the link between this and embracing the feminine wasn't really covered. After all, isn't being egotistical a largely male problem? And I'm guessing this comes across in how most men approach women. It's all about what they have, what they can do, trying to impress women in the way that they would try to impress men by trying to quantify themselves and evaluate themselves based on that. Yes. But women also generally consider masculine types like Mel Gibson, Brad Pitt, Don Johnson and so on sexy. As for having a feminine side, I think what's important here is balance, timing and the right amounts of gender role reversal. If someone is generally effeminate, he has to work on his masculinity. If one is generally masculine, he has to learn some femininity. Quote: No man naturally wants to stand up and slay his ego in front of others, and that's why I'm thinking it could be such a powerful thing to do, both for you and for women. How many men take this approach and how refreshing must it be? Yes. Spot on. However, this typically works in the context of man talk. It's acceptable behavior among men. Back in college, when an argument can't be settled through civil discussion, we decide the winner by putting boxing gloves on and punch and kick each other for 3 minutes for 3 rounds. In historical times, I think duels were common among men where the winner lives and the loser dies. Now, I think guys settle their differences with Half Life or Warcraft or basketball. Your observation is right on the dot. A good seducer has to realize that with women, it's different. You lose lots of pussy if you let your ego stand in the way. Quote: I read an article by Tyler recently about the "Secret Society" and it sounded like bullshit to me, but if there is such a thing, surely it must be a place where you leave your ego at the door. If women are ever going to consider you "the exception to the rule" it's because you just smash your own ego right there in front of them. It's marketing. The US FTC allows for a certain degree of marketing fluff. That's okay. Other than that, it's illegal and marketers can be penalized US $12,000 (or something close to it, can't remember the exact figure) when they get reported. For instance, when a PUA marketer says, I recommend this book by so and so because it's good and yet does not publicly disclose that he'll receive commissions from the endorsement, that's illegal. When he gets reported, he gets a fine. Quote: As I've said, when I made this comment, I felt like I was in exciting new territory, and I felt like they were there with me. I had made myself non-threatening by showing that I was willing to neg myself before they even thought of doing it. I felt like this created a new openness in them. It was just a different experience. Ah, yes. A eureka moment. This is one of the benefits of self discovery when you try things out in field. Quote: "Relax ladies, I don't expect any of you to come home with a dork like me" With your personality, I think that will work for you in field. All you have to do is validate it. With someone like bartm or Paramount, I think the result would be a disaster.

Author:	FlexBrah [ Sat Dec 14, 2013 7:57 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Self-disqualification?
OMG HellHound probably gets laid left and right! Shit had me laughing! LOL

Author:	Don Horneone [ Sun Dec 15, 2013 10:49 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Self-disqualification?
Quote: Quote: "Relax ladies, I don't expect any of you to come home with a dork like me" With your personality, I think that will work for you in field. All you have to do is validate it. With someone like bartm or Paramount, I think the result would be a disaster. I also thought of a comment for commenting on Facebook photos of girls I don't know: "XXXXX girl looks cute, does anyone know if she has anything against dorks?" I think the dork thing probably will play for me, but obviously needs to be field tested like anything else.

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