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PostPosted: Sun Aug 20, 2017 1:17 pm 
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I'll try and keep this short, i have a girl Im seeing (not official) for the past few months. Long story short, she was with a guy, seeing me at the same time. We started getting closer, eventually i said Im not interested in being in a love triangle, you do what you need to do. She leaves him and we start moving towards a relationship. Fast forward a month, Im overseas visiting family, and gradually we start losing touch. She was usually the one to initiate texting, but now it becomes less and less. I sense she's becoming more and more distant, less available. I ask her whats up, she says shes changed (on account of a lot of shitty situations which have come up lately), but her feelings for me haven't. Anyways, when we talked last i was supposed to have some minor surgery done the next day. At that point she tells me to let her know how it went, if i'd like. This was for me the most off-putting part. If your friend, gf, or some you cared about was going through some procedure you'd ask how it went, visit, whatever, not put it on the other person to report back. Anyways I never messaged about the surgery, and neither did she. Its been a few days of radio silence now. Should I keep up the radio silence, or just next her. I need someone with a clear head here. Thanks in advance

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 20, 2017 5:11 pm 
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I see two things wrong here. First thing is the obvious. You are wanting a girl without knowing what she's really like. It's been a few months, according to you, and during that time she's had a boyfriend and you've been away from her. When you are with a woman that has time constraints when it comes to you, she always has the ability to show her best self to you with minimal effort.

The main problem is that you were likely just a justification for leaving her boyfriend. If she were happy with him and who he was as a boyfriend, you would have never have been an option for her. Now that she's free of him, you are no longer as attractive as her new freedom.

If you want to keep this girl around, you have to give her some space to be free. If she really likes who you are, she will start wanting more of your time when you stop offering it.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 20, 2017 9:27 pm 
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JackZero wrote:
The main problem is that you were likely just a justification for leaving her boyfriend. If she were happy with him and who he was as a boyfriend, you would have never have been an option for her. Now that she's free of him, you are no longer as attractive as her new freedom.

If you want to keep this girl around, you have to give her some space to be free. If she really likes who you are, she will start wanting more of your time when you stop offering it.


This is spot on.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 20, 2017 11:15 pm 
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Spot on mate. Figure i should also clarify, her relationship was long distance so we were seeing each other quite a bit, and it was great while we were in the same city. You are right though i had the exact same thought. Thats actually why i told her she should be single for a bit before we jump into anything. She was ready to re arrange her life for me. Fast forward to our last convo and she says her defences were high towards everyone when i told her i felt we'd grown apart, that she feels afraid of me. It was almost like talking to a friend last time we talked, formal, no real emotion. You think radio silence is best option?Thanks for the clarity dude

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 1:00 am 
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Personally, I don't recommend radio silence as a tactic to get a girl. It's you making an investment and if it doesn't work, which is a good chance that it won't, then your next strategy is to find a new tactic to get the girl. I would recommend that you treat this girl like you would treat a guy friend. You don't need to talk to your guy friends every single day and probably not even every single week. The world keeps spinning and you handle your business like you normally do. If there is some real need to contact her, then you do that. If not, don't give her a second thought or that investment.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 3:03 am 
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thats the advice id give too. My only concern with messaging her first is that i feel this is one big shit test to see whether I'll do exactly that, cave and msg her first, putting her in the power position. She was usually the one to msg first. I was surprised when she didnt even check on how i was doing post op so i figured it would be best to let up a bit and give her that space you mentioned. Live life and see if she reinitiates or just next her altogether. Invested too much in the beginning it seems. What do you think?

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Last edited by DM on Mon Aug 21, 2017 3:50 am, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 3:15 am 
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I can't really answer that question. However, my question to you is why is she worth this?


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 4:01 am 
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To be fair its only recently that this happened, so the good outweighs the bad. Odd behaviour on her part, so im thinking its either a phase or a genuine lack/loss of attraction. I find in relationships, its little things like this adding up which fuck guys over in the end.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 4:09 am 
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DM wrote:
thats the advice id give too. My only concern with messaging her first is that i feel this is one big shit test to see whether I'll do exactly that, cave and msg her first, putting her in the power position.



I don't think it's this at all, and often a man will use it as an excuse for why a woman is losing interest in him. Sure, it does happen, but it's less likely to be the case.

More than likely someone else is a bit shinier to her right now.

Attractive women will always have options/orbiters. If you don't blow her mind in bed, or give her space to miss you, or remain emotionally-centered (over contact, smothering, etc), they'll pull away and re-engage with orbiters. A few months in she should've been talking to you about exclusivity.

But something is missing, whereas you aren't showing up in a way that is totally doing it for her and triggering her to "have the talk".


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She was usually the one to msg first. I was surprised when she didnt even check on how i was doing post op so i figured it would be best to let up a bit and give her that space you mentioned. Live life and see if she reinitiates or just next her altogether. Invested too much in the beginning it seems. What do you think?



It's possible. Give her a few days.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 4:28 am 
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I agree it could be orbiters, maybe the ex creeping up as they're in the same city now. Its all possible. Thing is we'll both be in the same city in a month so its nothing permanent. The point Jack made about me just being a catalyst for a relationship ending is what crossed my mind first, that shes just enjoying the freedom now. Either way somethings changed. We did talk about both exclusivity and future plans before i left--i wanted to plant that seed beforehand to prevent things like this from happening.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 4:41 am 
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She was usually the one to msg first. I was surprised when she didnt even check on how i was doing post op so i figured it would be best to let up a bit and give her that space you mentioned.


This is the problem with the insecure "let her chase you" style. No one wants to chase someone, and no one wants to think of themselves as the person doing the majority of the initiating. Eventually the chick thinks to herself, "why am I always the one starting the convo", she pulls back to see if you care, you don't, she moves on. Even if a chick is initiating or showing more interest, its better to show interest and initiate more so its balanced, that way you dont run into confusion/pulling back down the road.

That's not to say she isnt banging other guys, lost interest for another reason, was just using you to leave a shitty relationship....its more so to say you are playing a power game and maybe she is too. You've added that to the possible causes of whats going on. You say she has had shitty situations recently...well I dont know if you left it to her to initiate in these times and she thought the same thing you did; ie the other person doesnt care. You're playing power games, and whether she had an ex or not, you play games and you'll get games. If you like this chick and worried about contacting her first or not and what that would mean, then thats massive insecurity and an immature foundation for a relationship.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 6:03 am 
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You're right, she mentioned how she was the one initiating. Thing is, and I tell guys this all the time, texting is the most impersonal way to talk, so I prefer a phone call. I'd told her this too. Last time we spoke I ended up messaging her first, and there was a blockade that wasn't there before. Messaged back and forth for a while but there was no breaking into an 'us' frame. It threw me off entirely. She did mention that she was afraid of me, and had high walls towards people (on account of the drama thats been going on in her life--which women are always capable of generating), but told me to message her "if I like" about "how the procedure went". For me that there was the red flag. If I care about someone enough, it makes sense to call or check up on the person if they have some a medical procedure going on. Common courtesy. 'Tell me how it went' imo is reserved for trivial things--job interviews, exams etc. Maybe reading into it too much here, but somethings up. Its always easier to give out advice when you're a third party.

Whats going on in my mind is i dont want to msg now and hit the same brick wall i hit earlier.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 7:14 am 
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DM wrote:
We did talk about both exclusivity and future plans before i left--i wanted to plant that seed beforehand to prevent things like this from happening.



I wish you would've mentioned this earlier. Let the woman bring up exclusivity. One of the most common mistakes men make is trying to corrallwomen into relationships, but it almost never works. It has to be their idea. And the faster you hit all the right buttons (the five points I often mention), the faster they bring up "the talk".

It's possible she pulled back when you played the exclusive card (and make no mistake, even hinting at it is indeed having "the talk").

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 7:32 am 
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DM wrote:
You're right, she mentioned how she was the one initiating. Thing is, and I tell guys this all the time, texting is the most impersonal way to talk, so I prefer a phone call. I'd told her this too.


That's an insecure conversation. It shouldn't matter to you if it's a text or a call. It's too early, and you're not in a relationship. You shouldn't convey you care about any of this shit, because it comes off as needy.

Also, the frame is wrong. You want a call because you fear outcome of not communicating well (in your mind). If you're having sex with a woman and have a good in-person connection, texting or calling doesn't matter, just be secure in your in-person abilities....secure enough to understand that your presence is dominant enough that you should never worry about the mode of communication in-between meet ups.




Quote:
Last time we spoke I ended up messaging her first, and there was a blockade that wasn't there before.



I fucking guarantee you 100% it wasn't the wrong mode of phone communication that caused that.


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Messaged back and forth for a while but there was no breaking into an 'us' frame.


Why so many texts? I don't even text my gf of 1.6 years this much. And why worry about an "us" frame? You are not exclusive. I don't even worry about an "us" frame with my gf, lol. I live every day in the moment. Enjoy the moment, be light and playful, then get off the phone and go to work (or whatever else you have going on).



Quote:
It threw me off entirely. She did mention that she was afraid of me, and had high walls towards people (on account of the drama thats been going on in her life--which women are always capable of generating)


This is a red flag. I've been with plenty of women who said this, all of them either had a boyfriend, or were in a fight with an ex.

Understand that "drama" means complicated issues with other men. She's warning you subconsciously without actually saying the specifics.


Quote:
but told me to message her "if I like" about "how the procedure went". For me that there was the red flag.


Another red flag.

However, not uncommon from 9's and 10's who are pulling away from a man due to him being over-invested and smothering. Most men do not pick up on the fact they're being needy, but socially valuable women sniff this out like a grizzly bear on a bison carcass 10 miles up a valley.

Think about that for a second. Would you tell someone you really like to "message me if you like about your surgery"?

Fuck no.

This is what I would tell a woman I wanted nothing to do with anymore.

Also, I'm a little leery of how she came up with that specific response. I'm getting the vibe you got a little needy and over-invested, thus her very dominant male, aloof response to you. And you've stated in this thread you wanted her to step up emotionally concerning the surgery. This hints that you were a lot more invested than her. And your "seed planting" of exclusivity also helps to paint a picture of a guy who got a little too needy before the woman was invested. Overall, the tone I'm getting is she's acting more masculine than you right now.


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If I care about someone enough, it makes sense to call or check up on the person if they have some a medical procedure going on


Yep.


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Whats going on in my mind is i dont want to msg now and hit the same brick wall i hit earlier.



I would not message this girl back for now. You're the prize, her fucking loss. Go see other women.

I did the same thing you did a couple years back with a woman. The only medicine was pulling back, which creates a "needy cleanse".

In June, that girl asked me to break up with my gf and to take her camping instead. I told her "no."

There is always someone younger, hotter, and smarter.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 8:53 am 
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OP, this is what I'm having a hard time with. She's shown you her character but you're still pursuing it. She's the type that WILL cheat on you and at the same time, you're not the kind of guy that is willing to be a FWB or a FB with her. She's not giving you the type of attention that you want. However, you are pursuing a relationship with her. This makes me wonder what your options with women are?


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