Artful Roger Journal


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 Post subject: Re: Artful Roger Journal
PostPosted: Sat Feb 22, 2014 6:29 pm 
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Tr@veler wrote:
Well done!


Thanks!

Bond-007 wrote:
Take those muay thai boxing classes. I started boxing a month ago and my physical condition is already better, can`t imagine what it would be in 6 months if I don`t quit first.

I highly recommend you to read both The power of now by Tolle and The peaceful warrior by Millman.

Also meditate everyday, or as often as you can. 3 times a week, I don`t care.

Pay attention to the present moment, you are not your past nor your future. You are this moment. You are the now; when you grasp this concept fully, you`ll realize you never stopped being you. Your behaviour never defined you, not for a particular girl nor for a particular move.

Also Imma take a wild step here and recommend you not to hook up with this girl again for a while. If you can, not even seeing her. Time to focus. Don`t waste it.


Thanks bond, good to get a look in on those classes I will start them in a month just because the amount I have going on for my studies really needs my attention right now. Looking forward to gaining that physical condition though!

Also with the books the peaceful warrior puts me off a little because it's now a major-motion picture, makes me feel uneasy about it's credibility.



Wednesday

Went out with Traveller and his wing. We hit a student night club, pretty girls and cheap booze, a lot of drunk freshers too.

I did a few approaches, mostly ended in chit-chat, and nothing more. One girl I approached (Rhiannon), was pretty, great body and we laughing and joking around. She lived in Bethnal Green, I told her I went to a strip club there and then she told me about how many there were around there, strip clubs became a recurring joke. We talked about passions, she had one for business and fashion, wanted to start her own store of vintage clothing, trends and style pieces, so I joked that sounds like you're trying to print a magazine that appeals to everyone. Anyway I was able to get close and somewhat escalate, but not enough, I knew she was interested but couldn't quite get it working I was a little anxious inside I feel. Anyway, she went off to the dance floor to her friends, thinking about it now I should have said "yeah I'll come, it was kind of an open indentation by the way she touched my arm and chest.... Anyway I thought it was there to re-approach later. But I waited too long, she was kissing and subsequently went home with him. I walked passed them on the way home haha - what a kick in the nuts.

Thursday

Had intentions of some day game, went to the gym and thought about trying an approach. I was always eat my lunch in the uni cafeteria so I thought why not socialise why I do it? So I saw a caught girl on her own also eating lunch and went over to ask to sit down to share the table, she was fine with. I couldn't say anything, I actually had nothing to say! I could have even asked why she bought a Coke zero instead of diet Coke because Zero's aimed at men, and diet at women. Anything would have been good to get a conversation going, perhaps next time.

Friday

Just out with 2 pals of mine. Hit my student bar, got some cheap drinks in, opened a couple of girls went no where, just no interest in talking or giving me attention. Got opened by one girl at the bar, wasn't very hot at all and she was awkward, I spoke to her briefly but excused myself as I wanted to get away from her.

Changed venue to a place near me, a place where a live band plays and it's always good night. Anyway one friend of mine went home he had a busy day the next, so just me and the other guy. Anyway we head to the front of the stage where everyone was dancing, joined and got going on the dance floor. Saw this girl in front of me, dancing with some creepy guy, and her eyes basically said "rescue me" he was escalating on her and she was totally uncomfortable with it, anyway I caught eyes with her again and she mouthed "help me" at me, so in I went... "hey, how's it going?" and then she said bye to the other guy, was hugging me, pretending to be really pleased to see me, he went off, so I started talking (found out we grew up near to each other)- she was really pretty, then said "in danger of sounding like that guy, wanna dance?" she was up for it, started dancing with her, spun her around and then pulled her in close, she got really close and we were face to face almost kissing, noses touching, we almost kissed a few times, took a minute or 2 to get there but did eventually kiss her (plenty). She went to find her friend, and came back with her, then we danced a little more but she had to head off, she was out of town, and had to get a train at 2:45am, anyway I tried to convince her to get the morning train, but her friend wouldn't let it happen. Bit gutted as I knew she was interested in hooking up, she looked really gutted about leaving. No point in getting a number to be honest.

After that approached and danced with 2 Canadian chicks, well drunk, weren't interested. Went out separate ways at the end of the night.

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 Post subject: Re: Artful Roger Journal
PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2014 9:36 am 
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I didn't report back on that girl that I wanted ask out last weekend, anyway she didn't show up. I was a bit disappointed because she told me in person she would make it, and I text her a couple days later asking her in a playful manner why she didn't and got no response. Not too bothered just an opportunity I didn't want to pass up, at least I know I made an active effort to pursue things this time.

I ended up texting with the girl from valentines day who I hooked up, she started messaging me first and I set out to try and hook up with her again on saturday night. We met for a drink then she came back to mine, we had some drinks and she stayed around mine. We didn't have sex because she was on her period, I was quite indifferent at the time I wasn't bothered about having sex or not, I just would if I could, anyway she ended up giving me the most disappointing hand job lol (without me asking). I was just annoyed why would you agree to a hook-up knowing you couldn't actually do it? For the next day I felt really empty as it was unfulfilling experience, it had no emotional value, and I don't think I can do that again, at least not with her. She'll stay in the past now I won't message her again - well if I do it'll be to meet up and say this isn't going to work out.

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 Post subject: Re: Artful Roger Journal
PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2014 2:01 pm 
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Fuck that.

Girls don`t tell you to meet in order to say it`s over.

Only a girlfriend who thinks that needs closure, but a handjob girl doesn`t.

Only hook up with her if you want to have sex; give it a try. Who knows? Perhaps she`s good at it =)


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 Post subject: Re: Artful Roger Journal
PostPosted: Tue Mar 25, 2014 5:16 pm 
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@Bond I actually slept with her on valentines night, it was pretty good but she's such a poor kisser that I can't just have a casual thing with her, it just puts me right off her.

So my thesis and essay are in, and my finals are coming up but I have a little bit of time before I have to cut down on the development into my game. I'm tackling both inner game at the same time, as I think this will give me an even stronger outer game, funnily enough I'm quite happy with my current outer game skill set, at least for right now.

I bought Owen Marcus' "Grow Up" and have been quite delighted with the material in there so far, so I've been working on growing up and achieving a masculine emotional intelligence, as the books states - something that appeals to me.

In chapter 3 it emphasises getting away from emphasising your emotional stability on women and your childhood- to become independent, basically your own man.. something I am not. The book asks you to write a list of traits (which I have done), and then create a master list. Then you're to rate yourself in those traits on each and write how each one shows up in you. I figured I'd do that here.

Masculine: Stable, leader, integrity, reliable, problem solving, decisive
Feminine: Supportive, nurturing, expressive, sensitive, vulnerable,

Anyway onto my traits:

1= poor demonstration
10= excellent demonstration

Masculine:

Stable: 6/10. I'm talking being well balanced, I'm quite good at this while calm but I tend to not make a good point of call in stressful situations. I need to calm down and take a step back at times, then move forward not just use an anxious shotgun method like I've been doing a lot in the past to get past any problems or road blocks.

Leader: 3/10. I'm very poor at this in general, there's only specific situations I tend to be at leading and that's when I'm on my own and have to make them. I can't lead a group of people, I tend to sit back and let others make decisions but I do throw suggestions in there.

Integrity: 6/10. I'm a very honest person, I can tell people the truth and also handle it. The issue is I'm not integral to my own decisions, I feel like I need to seek acceptance of others, as in it's right to believe or behave that way.

Reliable: 9/10. I'm very good at this, and people can often rely on me to get a job done or turn up when needed, this doesn't need adjusting at all, I'm very proud of this aspect in me.

Problem solving 8/10. I'm also very good at this, I like to fix things whether objects, or help people out, however the reason I give 8 is because I'm not trying to be altruistic I need to care of myself too. Taking care of others is a form of procrastination to take care of yourself.

Decisive: 4/10. Another one I'm very poor at, I dwell on making decisions, I overthink a lot. However this benefits me in that the big decisions are always the right decisions, however little things - sometimes I just need to take action.

Feminine

Supportive 8/10. I think this is a positive trait, I'm very supportive of decisions anyone makes and I try to make sure there's no benefit in me achieving something through their decisions. If someone says I want to do this, I encourage them to go for it (need to apply this to myself a little more).

Nurturing: 3/10. Not very, apart from the occasional odd favour of doing something helpful for someone occasionally then there's not much. I've never looked to take someone under my wing and help them out, I don't really see this as a negative, as I'm no position to help someone out.

Expressive: 5/10. I often express my feelings internally and can handle them myself, but sometimes when I get really hurt I just dwell on emotions that aren't helpful to me. I guess this has it's benefits in that I process what I have to before diving into something new.

Sensitive 7/10. Probably overly so for at least a male. I guess this relates to what I wrote for integrity and decisive in masculine traits, but I reckon it's that deep lacking of support for my own wants and needs that exposes me here.

Vulnerable 3/10. Not particularly physically, but I guess this interrelated with sensitivity because there's always a chance of getting hurt if there's generally low-self esteem and anxieties floating around.

Over the next few days I'll be thinking of this list and how I show them, before I tackle them. In the meantime, and I know it's the internet but I've tried to be honest and out there with all my posts; so if anyone can leave any comments on my list and their thoughts on their aspect in relation to me, I would be really grateful.

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 Post subject: Re: Artful Roger Journal
PostPosted: Tue Mar 25, 2014 5:47 pm 
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artfulroger wrote:
@Bond I actually slept with her on valentines night, it was pretty good but she's such a poor kisser that I can't just have a casual thing with her, it just puts me right off her.

So my thesis and essay are in, and my finals are coming up but I have a little bit of time before I have to cut down on the development into my game. I'm tackling both inner game at the same time, as I think this will give me an even stronger outer game, funnily enough I'm quite happy with my current outer game skill set, at least for right now.

I bought Owen Marcus' "Grow Up" and have been quite delighted with the material in there so far, so I've been working on growing up and achieving a masculine emotional intelligence, as the books states - something that appeals to me.

In chapter 3 it emphasises getting away from emphasising your emotional stability on women and your childhood- to become independent, basically your own man.. something I am not. The book asks you to write a list of traits (which I have done), and then create a master list. Then you're to rate yourself in those traits on each and write how each one shows up in you. I figured I'd do that here.

Masculine: Stable, leader, integrity, reliable, problem solving, decisive
Feminine: Supportive, nurturing, expressive, sensitive, vulnerable,

Anyway onto my traits:

1= poor demonstration
10= excellent demonstration

Masculine:

Stable: 6/10. I'm talking being well balanced, I'm quite good at this while calm but I tend to not make a good point of call in stressful situations. I need to calm down and take a step back at times, then move forward not just use an anxious shotgun method like I've been doing a lot in the past to get past any problems or road blocks.

Leader: 3/10. I'm very poor at this in general, there's only specific situations I tend to be at leading and that's when I'm on my own and have to make them. I can't lead a group of people, I tend to sit back and let others make decisions but I do throw suggestions in there.

Integrity: 6/10. I'm a very honest person, I can tell people the truth and also handle it. The issue is I'm not integral to my own decisions, I feel like I need to seek acceptance of others, as in it's right to believe or behave that way.

Reliable: 9/10. I'm very good at this, and people can often rely on me to get a job done or turn up when needed, this doesn't need adjusting at all, I'm very proud of this aspect in me.

Problem solving 8/10. I'm also very good at this, I like to fix things whether objects, or help people out, however the reason I give 8 is because I'm not trying to be altruistic I need to care of myself too. Taking care of others is a form of procrastination to take care of yourself.

Decisive: 4/10. Another one I'm very poor at, I dwell on making decisions, I overthink a lot. However this benefits me in that the big decisions are always the right decisions, however little things - sometimes I just need to take action.

Feminine

Supportive 8/10. I think this is a positive trait, I'm very supportive of decisions anyone makes and I try to make sure there's no benefit in me achieving something through their decisions. If someone says I want to do this, I encourage them to go for it (need to apply this to myself a little more).

Nurturing: 3/10. Not very, apart from the occasional odd favour of doing something helpful for someone occasionally then there's not much. I've never looked to take someone under my wing and help them out, I don't really see this as a negative, as I'm no position to help someone out.

Expressive: 5/10. I often express my feelings internally and can handle them myself, but sometimes when I get really hurt I just dwell on emotions that aren't helpful to me. I guess this has it's benefits in that I process what I have to before diving into something new.

Sensitive 7/10. Probably overly so for at least a male. I guess this relates to what I wrote for integrity and decisive in masculine traits, but I reckon it's that deep lacking of support for my own wants and needs that exposes me here.

Vulnerable 3/10. Not particularly physically, but I guess this interrelated with sensitivity because there's always a chance of getting hurt if there's generally low-self esteem and anxieties floating around.

Over the next few days I'll be thinking of this list and how I show them, before I tackle them. In the meantime, and I know it's the internet but I've tried to be honest and out there with all my posts; so if anyone can leave any comments on my list and their thoughts on their aspect in relation to me, I would be really grateful.


http://www.rsdnation.com/ozzie/blog/do- ... ets-use-it


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 Post subject: Re: Artful Roger Journal
PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 8:53 am 
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Quote:
http://www.rsdnation.com/ozzie/blog/do-you-have-sticking-point-lets-use-it


I like this video, it's so true, there's really no such thing as sticking points, just false limiting-beliefs.


On another note I just read this blog:
http://charliehoehn.com/2013/02/24/the- ... mployment/

I can totally relate to it, I'm at a point in my career where I want freelance work so I totally see myself in the number 6 position of his scale. But more importantly with the dating aspect he writes about, well I fee like I'm back at number 1 again, like I suck and can't get anyone. But the truth is I just got out of number 5 where, the last 3 girls I slept with I just played the part I thought I should and feel really shitty about it at the time. Time to put myself out there honestly and genuinely.

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 Post subject: Re: Artful Roger Journal
PostPosted: Sat Apr 12, 2014 3:29 pm 
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So haven't updated in a while mainly as my uni course is ending soon and I really need to work hard for the exams that start in a months time. Also currently working on an essay.

Just trying to summarise this week:

There was a really hot girl in the library when I was working and I wanted to meet her, she was so good looking she was putting me off my work! Anyway I didn't approach because I didn't know what to say, however on reflection I should have said "Hi, sorry for staring but you're so attractive, I wanted to come and meet you, my names ___."

The next day I was in a Costa grabbing a coffee on the way to uni and there was a really hot girl I wanted to meet, again stuck without an opener, just blank lines in my head. Since it was a Costa at my uni, I should have just stood near her and said "Hi, working hard?" like I knew her already.

And last night I went out for some drinks with my professor, 2 Phd students and 3 fellow students. He bought us all drinks because we worked so hard and well on our projects/thesis' we had a couple of rounds and had a great laugh with him. Then they headed off but the students and I stayed out some more people came out and we just got really drunk basically, one of the girls had just broken up with her boyfriend fairly recently she was all over me, leaning on me, hitting me, touching my thigh, so I knew there would be a chance for something to happen and I was planning it in my head how to do it, isolate, make a move, etc., but she went home as we changed venues as she had work the next morning.
We headed to a local bar with live music, and danced and drank some more, I thought I actually haven't approached someone in ages while out, because I haven't been out in a long time due lack of money and expandable time. So we were dancing and I noticed a really hot girl and her friend dancing near me with 2 guys, they weren't together the guys had just shuffled their way next to them, she kept looking at me, so I knew she was interested and I wanted to chat to her, but waited and waited and waited, after all that waiting she was kissing one of those guys. Snooze you lose. A little while after that I went to buy a round, and saw a really cute girl, I wasn't missing out this time I think I said something like, "What cocktail are you getting?" we chatted a little bit then I said a line that seems to get a lot of laughs "in danger of sounding like I'm trying to pick you up, but do you come here often?" and she laughed again, we exchanged names and then she spotted her friends and went off. After about 10 minutes our group decided to leave, so I re-approached told her that I was heading out and asked for her number, but phrased similarly to something like "I'm just heading out, but I wanted to come and ask for your number, and don't worry if you don't want to give it out" she asked me, what was my name? I laughed and said you're her name from part of London, got my phone and she told me her number, I don't even know if it's the right one, I'll shoot a text over to her soon to find out. Which didn't share that much of a connection so I doubt she'd be open to seeing/meeting me one-on-one, going try and build that over text - if possible.

Some thoughts and rambling's:

On Monday night I was at a friend of mine's for her birthday, she hosted a small gathering. A conversation came up where one of the girls was talking about her relationship with her current boyfriend, she basically was saying she had no idea if they'd be together next year and where things were going. I just found this a really interesting insight into how girls work, they hate to be alone and if a better model comes along they'll jump ship - well unless they're not in love and devoted already I would assume.

Secondly, hooking up within social groups. There's a couple of girls that I know where I'm not too invested in them or the groups they operate in where I'd like to hook up with them, but I don't know how. Obviously it would need to be kept under wraps because a girl's most valuable asset is their reputation. I don't even know where to begin with starting something like that.

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 Post subject: Re: Artful Roger Journal
PostPosted: Mon Apr 14, 2014 2:38 pm 
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I remember kasabi advicing me once that, as a pua, you should ALWAYS have a list of at least five openers at the tip of your tongue.

Work on a list about that and remember; it`s just a good conversation starter. So no need to use situational always with girls, just think about 5 good ones and shoot em out.


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 Post subject: Re: Artful Roger Journal
PostPosted: Mon Apr 21, 2014 9:26 am 
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@Bond. I'm good for it at night, but daytime is where I struggle for it. Definitely need to do some opener exercises at some point.

So I was back in my home town for a couple of days, on Saturday I went out with some friends, and they both have girlfriends so if I wanted to approach women it'd be on my own and own admission. There's was a girl sitting on the this booth on her own, friend at the bar, and both my friends were like "go talk to her!" At first, I was making excuses which basically sounded like "waaa, waaaa" but then I just thought what's the worst that can happen? So I went over (she had this really low cut top with AMAZING boobs lol) and I started chatting, made a comment on her drink because it was this pint glass with like 3 upside down VK bottles in and a shitload of straws, "that must be a birthday drink?" it wasn't her birthday, got her name and age, and chatted in general for a little while. The funny thing was I was really cool and confident, and she said "you're not from around here are you?" so told her I was living in London, and I reckon she said this because the guys round my hometown area 1. all dress the same and 2. are mega chodes. Got their logistics for later, they were going to a different club to us, damn. Wouldn't budge on going to the same one as us. That ended there.

Went to a different pub, the 2 guys I was with noticed a few girls from school, started chatting to them, I got paired off with the other girl, and we got on great chatting for a good 30 mins, about everything really. Then we switched pubs, turns out she works in London and travels there everyday - so a good chance for a meet up, perhaps when she finishes work or something. She asked what I did, for the second time, and I really teased her about this turned the gender roles, "have you been listening to anything I've been saying tonight? You're just looking to take me home aren't you?" Since at this point there was a really good vibe between us, I told her about the area I live (Camden) and blew it up to be the best experience of a lifetime. For an outsider it really is. Then transitioned into this we have to go to this bar, live blues bands, great cocktails you'll love it, she was game so I got her number, and then sent her a text right there and then "get to camden!" and she text back right away "yes!" Normally I'm hesitant about these conversations as I was pretty drunk, but I equally know she was as drunk. I'll see where this one goes.

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 Post subject: Re: Artful Roger Journal
PostPosted: Sun Apr 27, 2014 8:20 pm 
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I actually set out today to improve my openers. Every time I hit the gym I normally have something to eat after for about 20 minutes in a small cafe next to the gym, and there's always cute girls there so I decided to use this time effectively today. And these 20 minute exercises will happen 4x times a week, so I'm guessing I'll eventually get very good at coming up with these on the spot - that's the theory anyway.

As it was a Sunday there was only one cute girl in there and it was pretty dead. She had blonde hair, well dressed, was working on a Macbook, papers and books spread all over the desk, also wearing headphones. Decided to write these down in my notepad:

- Did you get kicked out of starbucks because you're actually working instead of pretending to work?
- You're lucky it's not busy in here, these are no manors for table sharing
- Are you actually getting work done under all this chaos (pointing at books and papers)
- By the way you're working I bet there's a rave going on in those headphones
- Did you just hit the gym hard and now the books even harder?

I'll aim for 5 every time.

Da, I like what you said about preparing jokes, or good stories. The problem is trying to unnaturally fit it into a conversation, but nonetheless being aware of your "best" selection isn't a bad thing I suppose. I actually did a write up of some of my favourite places to go for a day 2 a few pages back. The good thing is, although I wrote them ages ago, they've actually stuck with me.

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 Post subject: Re: Artful Roger Journal
PostPosted: Sun Apr 27, 2014 9:53 pm 
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artfulroger wrote:
I actually set out today to improve my openers. Every time I hit the gym I normally have something to eat after for about 20 minutes in a small cafe next to the gym, and there's always cute girls there so I decided to use this time effectively today. And these 20 minute exercises will happen 4x times a week, so I'm guessing I'll eventually get very good at coming up with these on the spot - that's the theory anyway.

As it was a Sunday there was only one cute girl in there and it was pretty dead. She had blonde hair, well dressed, was working on a Macbook, papers and books spread all over the desk, also wearing headphones. Decided to write these down in my notepad:

- Did you get kicked out of starbucks because you're actually working instead of pretending to work?
- You're lucky it's not busy in here, these are no manors for table sharing
- Are you actually getting work done under all this chaos (pointing at books and papers)
- By the way you're working I bet there's a rave going on in those headphones
- Did you just hit the gym hard and now the books even harder?

I'll aim for 5 every time.

Da, I like what you said about preparing jokes, or good stories. The problem is trying to unnaturally fit it into a conversation, but nonetheless being aware of your "best" selection isn't a bad thing I suppose. I actually did a write up of some of my favourite places to go for a day 2 a few pages back. The good thing is, although I wrote them ages ago, they've actually stuck with me.


Hey buddy, mind if I give you some advice?

It's good that you're working on these openers, however please note that there is a flaw in this. You're focusing on the opener a lot, and on what to say after the opener, however the key to getting girls is to not care about getting them. To want them, but not care if you get this specific one or not. Once you actually stop caring, you actually also stop caring about the opener. My openers range from "hi i wanted to meet you" to "you look like jack sparrow". It's not like I'm writing these down, I'm just spouting shit. Why am I spouting shit? Because I don't care.

How do you get to this "not caring" point? You cannot fake it. Therefore you have to reach it. How? By an ABUNDANCE of approaches, an ABUNDANCE of interactions. ABC, always be closing, sure, but once you have an abundance of pretty much everything, you think to yourself, if I don't get this chick, the next one might be a good interaction. And if that one doesn't work, then there's another 100.

Once you have this down, you get to the point where you think "It'll happen at some point or another". You're putting in the effort, you're doing everything within your control, and then you just "let it be". Whatever the universe has in store for you will happen. Maybe the next 100 are all shit, or maybe you're on a lucky streak. WHO KNOWS. It doesn't matter.

Develop a love for the GAME, not for the girl. The GAME is hilarious once you actually play it, once you make it your own. But don't do it for the sake of increasing your "batting average", do it beacuse, hell, why not have fun. Why not have fun on the way to the next lay? You have very little control over getting a lay. You can do certain things, like be persistent, go for the pull, go for the number, talk shit, go for the makeout, but she might have a BF, she might be real busy, have a really bad day, or whatever. Over this you have no control. Not even the best opener will do much for you here. Therefore, if you have so little control, why not HAVE FUN? This game can be tough, but only because you make it so. You have to realize there is very little control over the person you're interacting with. All you can do is possibly spike her emotions and get her invested in you. Other than that, who the fuck knows.

So with this mentality of "I'm doing everything that is within my control, so now I'll just let it be and see what happens and have fun on the way to the next success" the opener doesn't matter anymore. Forget getting the best opener, focus on the big picture. The GAME in general. You can work on specifics, sure, but you are putting so much worth on the opener, or on what to say after the opener, that the girl can feel it. get rid of this caring, and truly have fun in the moment.

So in the end, the opener becomes an opener for YOU. If your mentality is what I mentioned above in quotation marks, and your goal is to have FUN along the way, then you will choose an opener where you are AMUSED. Where you have fun. You will not care about the girl's reaction, beacuse all you care about is your own reaction. If you want to have fun there, then the opener and everything after the opener will take care of that. This is why I get away with so much bullshit talk when I speak with girls. I talked to a girl about crosspuking the other day. Her friend said she crosspuked (where two people puke and form a cross with their streams), and I told her friend she and I should cross puke and that it'll be romantic. Was I thinking about "will this spike her emotions?" NO! I thought that shit was hilarious, because it was the beginning of the night and fuck I can't care less anymore about what these chicks think of me. The game is tough as it is, so might as well have fun.

And you get to this mentality, as I said, by a complete ABUNDANCE of interactions. If you were to go out every day, or 5 days a week let's say, and you dedicated yourself, committed yourself to it, and stopped counting approaches and just approached and approached and approached, hell at one point or another, you're gonna get laid. Maybe quite a lot.

And then you AUTOMATICALLY get good on the side because after so many interactions you calibrate yourself. You realize what works and what doesn't. You get REFERENCE EXPERIENCES, as RSD calls it. There guys from RSD are so good because they have done SO MANY approaches. Literally thousands, and they go out 6-7 nights a week, getting more and more and more experience, live experience. Doing trial and error, for real. That is how you truly get good. That is how you will get the great opener. Do trial and error in real life. You will EMOTIONALLY learn the game, because the game will push you from side to side calibrating you as you go. This burns, this works. And it will also force you to truly learn to self amuse. Because at one point the game really becomes bullshit, so much pain so much hurt, by the end you think fuck it, let's have fun. That's how you get the great story. If you are seeking that by then, that is.


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 Post subject: Re: Artful Roger Journal
PostPosted: Sun Apr 27, 2014 10:53 pm 
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Tr@veler wrote:
Hey buddy, mind if I give you some advice?

It's good that you're working on these openers, however please note that there is a flaw in this. You're focusing on the opener a lot, and on what to say after the opener, however the key to getting girls is to not care about getting them. To want them, but not care if you get this specific one or not. Once you actually stop caring, you actually also stop caring about the opener. My openers range from "hi i wanted to meet you" to "you look like jack sparrow". It's not like I'm writing these down, I'm just spouting shit. Why am I spouting shit? Because I don't care.

How do you get to this "not caring" point? You cannot fake it. Therefore you have to reach it. How? By an ABUNDANCE of approaches, an ABUNDANCE of interactions. ABC, always be closing, sure, but once you have an abundance of pretty much everything, you think to yourself, if I don't get this chick, the next one might be a good interaction. And if that one doesn't work, then there's another 100.

Once you have this down, you get to the point where you think "It'll happen at some point or another". You're putting in the effort, you're doing everything within your control, and then you just "let it be". Whatever the universe has in store for you will happen. Maybe the next 100 are all shit, or maybe you're on a lucky streak. WHO KNOWS. It doesn't matter.

Develop a love for the GAME, not for the girl. The GAME is hilarious once you actually play it, once you make it your own. But don't do it for the sake of increasing your "batting average", do it beacuse, hell, why not have fun. Why not have fun on the way to the next lay? You have very little control over getting a lay. You can do certain things, like be persistent, go for the pull, go for the number, talk shit, go for the makeout, but she might have a BF, she might be real busy, have a really bad day, or whatever. Over this you have no control. Not even the best opener will do much for you here. Therefore, if you have so little control, why not HAVE FUN? This game can be tough, but only because you make it so. You have to realize there is very little control over the person you're interacting with. All you can do is possibly spike her emotions and get her invested in you. Other than that, who the fuck knows.

So with this mentality of "I'm doing everything that is within my control, so now I'll just let it be and see what happens and have fun on the way to the next success" the opener doesn't matter anymore. Forget getting the best opener, focus on the big picture. The GAME in general. You can work on specifics, sure, but you are putting so much worth on the opener, or on what to say after the opener, that the girl can feel it. get rid of this caring, and truly have fun in the moment.

So in the end, the opener becomes an opener for YOU. If your mentality is what I mentioned above in quotation marks, and your goal is to have FUN along the way, then you will choose an opener where you are AMUSED. Where you have fun. You will not care about the girl's reaction, beacuse all you care about is your own reaction. If you want to have fun there, then the opener and everything after the opener will take care of that. This is why I get away with so much bullshit talk when I speak with girls. I talked to a girl about crosspuking the other day. Her friend said she crosspuked (where two people puke and form a cross with their streams), and I told her friend she and I should cross puke and that it'll be romantic. Was I thinking about "will this spike her emotions?" NO! I thought that shit was hilarious, because it was the beginning of the night and fuck I can't care less anymore about what these chicks think of me. The game is tough as it is, so might as well have fun.

And you get to this mentality, as I said, by a complete ABUNDANCE of interactions. If you were to go out every day, or 5 days a week let's say, and you dedicated yourself, committed yourself to it, and stopped counting approaches and just approached and approached and approached, hell at one point or another, you're gonna get laid. Maybe quite a lot.

And then you AUTOMATICALLY get good on the side because after so many interactions you calibrate yourself. You realize what works and what doesn't. You get REFERENCE EXPERIENCES, as RSD calls it. There guys from RSD are so good because they have done SO MANY approaches. Literally thousands, and they go out 6-7 nights a week, getting more and more and more experience, live experience. Doing trial and error, for real. That is how you truly get good. That is how you will get the great opener. Do trial and error in real life. You will EMOTIONALLY learn the game, because the game will push you from side to side calibrating you as you go. This burns, this works. And it will also force you to truly learn to self amuse. Because at one point the game really becomes bullshit, so much pain so much hurt, by the end you think fuck it, let's have fun. That's how you get the great story. If you are seeking that by then, that is.


Hey buddy, mind if I give you some advice? If you don't care about getting girls, consider staying home. You've reached your level or autonomous approaching through shit volume. You're a low level telemarketer making 1,000 calls a day so you're suggesting to others to reach this level. You are suggesting for others offer shit because most girls will give you shit responses back any way. . . and you know they do (to you). This is bottom of the barrel crap. There is no other area in life where this is the formula for success. It does not work in academia, sports, nor any sectors of professional life. Hell, you definitely won't make many friends navigating your life this way. And for some odd reason, this seems to be a recurring theme in pick up. "Go amuse yourself.". . . "Go tell them any shit you want." . . . I can think of only one instance in life where this type of advice is given; it's when the circus owner tells its chicken head biting circus freak shows to step on stage to give the audience a show. "Go amuse yourself! Do whatever the fuck you want to do. Pull your dick out and piss on the stage. Bend over and stick my cane up your ass. . hahahah you fucking retard! Hahahah! Dance retard! Dance!" - Do you understand that you are doing this on your own without a circus master forcing you to do it?

The idea of "abundance" is to have an "abundance" of positive interactions. . . an "abundance" of strong attraction. . . an "abundance" of girls who even if they shoot you down out of uncontrollable circumstances (they're on the rag, they have a boyfriend, they forgot to shower, etc. . .) they tell themselves and others, "WOW, that guy is hot!" (And if you've been with an "abundance" of women, you'd know that they are not referring to only you're physical appearance)

The term "trial and error" refers to a system of problem solving through repeated attempts through varying methods until you reach your goal. You start off with the BEST METHOD you can come up with now. Then as you make more attempts, you vary your strategy . . .

Trial and error DOES NOT refer to a system of not giving a fuck about results or doing whatever the fuck you want to do. This is the most retarded bullshit in pick up and we see this again, again, and again. And I am getting somewhat sick of this RFB, DRT, PTC, RGB, Kungfu Pick up system morons who have nothing going for them (Guess why?) other than a legion of equally lost followers taking orders to "dance retard, dance".

Writing up 5 openers is NOTHING. Most guys put more effort into figuring out which porn to jack off to on a Monday night. Writing a little cheat sheet is NOTHING. Most guys put more effort into researching their next game on xBox. Caring enough to think about another human being. . . and telling her something that reflects her life and injects just a tiny bit of "happy" into her day is NOTHING. Most guys put more effort into thinking up which toppings to order for their pizza.


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 Post subject: Re: Artful Roger Journal
PostPosted: Sun Apr 27, 2014 11:34 pm 
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Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2011 10:22 am
Posts: 1200
Location: London
kasabi wrote:
Tr@veler wrote:
Hey buddy, mind if I give you some advice?

It's good that you're working on these openers, however please note that there is a flaw in this. You're focusing on the opener a lot, and on what to say after the opener, however the key to getting girls is to not care about getting them. To want them, but not care if you get this specific one or not. Once you actually stop caring, you actually also stop caring about the opener. My openers range from "hi i wanted to meet you" to "you look like jack sparrow". It's not like I'm writing these down, I'm just spouting shit. Why am I spouting shit? Because I don't care.

How do you get to this "not caring" point? You cannot fake it. Therefore you have to reach it. How? By an ABUNDANCE of approaches, an ABUNDANCE of interactions. ABC, always be closing, sure, but once you have an abundance of pretty much everything, you think to yourself, if I don't get this chick, the next one might be a good interaction. And if that one doesn't work, then there's another 100.

Once you have this down, you get to the point where you think "It'll happen at some point or another". You're putting in the effort, you're doing everything within your control, and then you just "let it be". Whatever the universe has in store for you will happen. Maybe the next 100 are all shit, or maybe you're on a lucky streak. WHO KNOWS. It doesn't matter.

Develop a love for the GAME, not for the girl. The GAME is hilarious once you actually play it, once you make it your own. But don't do it for the sake of increasing your "batting average", do it beacuse, hell, why not have fun. Why not have fun on the way to the next lay? You have very little control over getting a lay. You can do certain things, like be persistent, go for the pull, go for the number, talk shit, go for the makeout, but she might have a BF, she might be real busy, have a really bad day, or whatever. Over this you have no control. Not even the best opener will do much for you here. Therefore, if you have so little control, why not HAVE FUN? This game can be tough, but only because you make it so. You have to realize there is very little control over the person you're interacting with. All you can do is possibly spike her emotions and get her invested in you. Other than that, who the fuck knows.

So with this mentality of "I'm doing everything that is within my control, so now I'll just let it be and see what happens and have fun on the way to the next success" the opener doesn't matter anymore. Forget getting the best opener, focus on the big picture. The GAME in general. You can work on specifics, sure, but you are putting so much worth on the opener, or on what to say after the opener, that the girl can feel it. get rid of this caring, and truly have fun in the moment.

So in the end, the opener becomes an opener for YOU. If your mentality is what I mentioned above in quotation marks, and your goal is to have FUN along the way, then you will choose an opener where you are AMUSED. Where you have fun. You will not care about the girl's reaction, beacuse all you care about is your own reaction. If you want to have fun there, then the opener and everything after the opener will take care of that. This is why I get away with so much bullshit talk when I speak with girls. I talked to a girl about crosspuking the other day. Her friend said she crosspuked (where two people puke and form a cross with their streams), and I told her friend she and I should cross puke and that it'll be romantic. Was I thinking about "will this spike her emotions?" NO! I thought that shit was hilarious, because it was the beginning of the night and fuck I can't care less anymore about what these chicks think of me. The game is tough as it is, so might as well have fun.

And you get to this mentality, as I said, by a complete ABUNDANCE of interactions. If you were to go out every day, or 5 days a week let's say, and you dedicated yourself, committed yourself to it, and stopped counting approaches and just approached and approached and approached, hell at one point or another, you're gonna get laid. Maybe quite a lot.

And then you AUTOMATICALLY get good on the side because after so many interactions you calibrate yourself. You realize what works and what doesn't. You get REFERENCE EXPERIENCES, as RSD calls it. There guys from RSD are so good because they have done SO MANY approaches. Literally thousands, and they go out 6-7 nights a week, getting more and more and more experience, live experience. Doing trial and error, for real. That is how you truly get good. That is how you will get the great opener. Do trial and error in real life. You will EMOTIONALLY learn the game, because the game will push you from side to side calibrating you as you go. This burns, this works. And it will also force you to truly learn to self amuse. Because at one point the game really becomes bullshit, so much pain so much hurt, by the end you think fuck it, let's have fun. That's how you get the great story. If you are seeking that by then, that is.


Hey buddy, mind if I give you some advice? If you don't care about getting girls, consider staying home. You've reached your level or autonomous approaching through shit volume. You're a low level telemarketer making 1,000 calls a day so you're suggesting to others to reach this level. You are suggesting for others offer shit because most girls will give you shit responses back any way. . . and you know they do (to you). This is bottom of the barrel crap. There is no other area in life where this is the formula for success. It does not work in academia, sports, nor any sectors of professional life. Hell, you definitely won't make many friends navigating your life this way. And for some odd reason, this seems to be a recurring theme in pick up. "Go amuse yourself.". . . "Go tell them any shit you want." . . . I can think of only one instance in life where this type of advice is given; it's when the circus owner tells its chicken head biting circus freak shows to step on stage to give the audience a show. "Go amuse yourself! Do whatever the fuck you want to do. Pull your dick out and piss on the stage. Bend over and stick my cane up your ass. . hahahah you fucking retard! Hahahah! Dance retard! Dance!" - Do you understand that you are doing this on your own without a circus master forcing you to do it?

The idea of "abundance" is to have an "abundance" of positive interactions. . . an "abundance" of strong attraction. . . an "abundance" of girls who even if they shoot you down out of uncontrollable circumstances (they're on the rag, they have a boyfriend, they forgot to shower, etc. . .) they tell themselves and others, "WOW, that guy is hot!" (And if you've been with an "abundance" of women, you'd know that they are not referring to only you're physical appearance)

The term "trial and error" refers to a system of problem solving through repeated attempts through varying methods until you reach your goal. You start off with the BEST METHOD you can come up with now. Then as you make more attempts, you vary your strategy . . .

Trial and error DOES NOT refer to a system of not giving a fuck about results or doing whatever the fuck you want to do. This is the most retarded bullshit in pick up and we see this again, again, and again. And I am getting somewhat sick of this RFB, DRT, PTC, RGB, Kungfu Pick up system morons who have nothing going for them (Guess why?) other than a legion of equally lost followers taking orders to "dance retard, dance".

Writing up 5 openers is NOTHING. Most guys put more effort into figuring out which porn to jack off to on a Monday night. Writing a little cheat sheet is NOTHING. Most guys put more effort into researching their next game on xBox. Caring enough to think about another human being. . . and telling her something that reflects her life and injects just a tiny bit of "happy" into her day is NOTHING. Most guys put more effort into thinking up which toppings to order for their pizza.


Wow Kasabi, thanks for the flame.

Now, let's back up here a little bit and calm ourselves. Firstly, staying at home, as you said, will not get you anywhere. However, my post indicated that he go out, and go out a lot, in order to turn this theory stuff into practice. I'm sorry, but this is the ONLY way to get better. If there is one thing that will get you better at pickup, it is going out and doing it. Not theorizing about it, not writing down openers, but doing it. Guess what, if you go up to a girl and say "hi" that's an opener, you just opened the conversation. Why write shit down BEFORE you do it? Why not write shit down AFTER you do it? Then you do not only have a new opener, but also a reference for that opener. Is one reference enough? Fuck no. If she had a bad day and gave you a shitty response, and you base the "effectiveness" of the opener on that reaction, guess what, you'll be saying "Oh that opener doesn't work!" However if you do it 10 more times and get varied responses, your perception of that opener has now changed.

If you base your idea of abundance on an "abundance of positive interactions" but...oh no!...you get positive AND negative interactions...oh no suddenly you suck! Suddenly you're shit! WTF? No you're not. You have very little control over how a girl responds that basing how good you are on her reaction to something you said is stupid. There are key elements in pickup that can change a girl's emotions, for sure. However theorizing over it but not actually doing it a LOT will not get you very far. A martial artist may have been taught a sequence of moves, however it will only flow beautifully once he has done it a LOT of times.

Dude I'm actually agreeing with a lot of what you are saying. Once you have the skillset and also the mindset, you are an attractive guy to a LOT of girls, ones who have boyfriends, ones who have that special time of the month, or whatever. But to go into an interaction hoping it will go well is a form of neediness. To try and think of the "perfect opener" is a form of neediness. "This girl is sitting by herself in a cafe, what will get the best reaction?" You will never know what will get the best reaction, and it doesn't matter. All that matters is that you go in, and when you go in might as well have fun with it. After the opener you can calibrate anyway, if she's receptive all you might have to do is be a cool dude and not say anything stupid, or you might have to do most of the talking if she's not open at first...who knows? But you will only learn it after you've done it a LOT of times. And by doing it a lot of times you will fuck up a lot. Maybe you didn't fuck up a lot. Maybe you strategized really well after every single interaction that your results went up like crazy, mine didn't. It took me a long time to go from someone who can hardly have a normal conversation with people, to being able to fuck girls I meet in bars, clubs, streets or wherever else. And the way I got there was made MORE difficult for myself by me trying to think of the best this or that and putting an insane amount of value on what I said or what I did.

If you actually tried to understand my post you might have gotten that I said you have to want, but not care if you get the girl. Caring if you get her is neediness. "Oh man, she's so pretty, I have to have her." For a lot of guys this instills fear. Fear of loss, and thus every word that comes out of their mouths is calculated to the point where they think they might fuck up any moment. However if you do it for the sake of bettering yourself and ultimately finding the fun in bettering yourself, the high level of caring is gone. Your aim becomes to better your pickup skill, rather than actually getting the girl. And as you know the end result of a pickup is a lay. So if you are working on bettering your pickup skills, or like I said in my previous post "Develop a love for the GAME, not the girl", you are fine tuning your skills and thus making the lay more efficient. You indirectly become better at seducing girls.

And well if you don't have fun developing your own game, then that sucks for you dude. I have finally found the fun in game, and I see it in my wings as well. They have developed a love for the game, at getting better at the game, and are going out a lot, doing a lot of approaches, so that they can get better at this pickup stuff. That is their goal. It is not to find "the one" or get this specific girl. And their game has improved a lot.

But whatever man, go flame if you want.


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 Post subject: Re: Artful Roger Journal
PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2014 10:12 pm 
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Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2012 12:03 pm
Posts: 198
Location: London
For me making an approach personal, allows me to be authentic and showing interest in someone is actually quite rare, and I pride myself on being different. I can live with not getting 100s of lays, I'm just here to meet quality women, and I know they don't lurk in bars or clubs (generally speaking).

I'll expand on this later, but now I have to rant.

I am literally dumbfounded at some of the girls I know and the AFCs/beta males(hell even delta males) they are dating. I went to a party last night and for the first time a girl I know brought her boyfriend. She is really smart, really cute and very open minded. And I thought her boyfriend would have been of the same ilk, well how wrong I was. He is a plumber, and his hobbies involve the gym, boxing and being passionate about football, he could express his feelings for football more so than her.

A second girl, albeit went through a mentally abusive relationship last year; is currently seeing a guy in his early 30s he works as a hotel doorman, and is basically an alcoholic, he necks a few beers every night on his own in a dark room. She is really pretty and incredibly open, she told me the depths of that abusive relationship last night, it was intriguing stuff. They've been seeing each other 6 months.

Kasabi, you've often written the formula on this forum, value = perceived benefits/cost. I do not see any value these guys attribute to their lives, I really don't. Their habits are plain and predictable, they operate unconsciously and have probably never tried to do anything challenging recently. Hell they're not even fun or exciting, my only prediction is they're a "make do" until a better deal comes along. Then it's too far down the line, and these girls have already developed feelings and can't bare to live without them, it's probably more attachment than love.

If I was to sum up my behaviours, maybe I'm a little awkward occasionally I'm well aware of that and working on it. But generally I'm a good attentive listener, and have strong moral values that don't shift. I feel I have a dynamic personality I show interest in areas of personal development, I look into finance, fitness, health/eating correctly, I'm studying to develop my career and also I'm finding my muse, I'm currently working on a project developing an online product with a sexual health psychologist for something that is in high demand and doesn't exist. I'm doing a hell of a lot of research on marketing on the way.

IS this^ what I need to express? But I would rather just get on with it than needlessly discuss it. Something feels out of line here, maybe there's too much ego and arrogance floating around on my part, but if these are the guys I'm up against I have absolutely zero qualms about how my dating life is going to turn out when I finish my exams in 5 weeks. Perhaps I'm missing something? I really don't know, dumbfounded and amazed.

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My Journal is thoughts on life game and approaches: http://www.pick-up-artist-forum.com/artful-roger-journal-vt148980.html


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 Post subject: Re: Artful Roger Journal
PostPosted: Fri May 02, 2014 10:07 pm 
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"Really smart": Can you describe that to me? How is she smart? Did she show you her college entrance exams? Her thoughts on global warming? Does she have a PhD in physics? Describe to me what SMART means to you. Do you want to know why many girls don't date men of high value and never will? It's because their perception of self worth is so low that in their WILDEST DREAMS, they couldn't imagine that a man of any value would ask them out for any reason other than to taste of her vagina. It's simple as that. As long as you play it straight with them, they play it straight with you. And don't be so quick to label other guys this way or that way. The plumber sounds like loads of fun. . . and a guy who docks his boat a few boats away from me is a plumber. . . a very good one.

Your story reminds me of a cousin who told me about a friend whose daughter was dating the dishwashing boy of some local restaurant. They got to talking about it and decided it was a good idea to get her out of slummy areas and get her to hang out in wealthier, more "classy" places. Here's my reply to my cousin, "Remember I told you that I had dinner at ______'s castle and ______'s rooftop of his own building in HK? They have more dishwashers in both places than the entire town where that girl works." - think about what this means. People always tend to meet their "match" no matter what. . .


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