May have messed up something really great - Need Help!!


Go to page 1, 2  Next
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests
Post new topic Reply to topic   Board index » Real Life Gaming » Field Reports




Author Message
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2017 12:06 pm 
Offline
New to MPUA Forum

Joined: Sun May 29, 2016 8:29 pm
Posts: 7
This is a bit of a long one. Sorry about that. This is a bit embarrassing, since it is pretty basic stuff.

Okay, so I know that it is generally not a good thing to get caught up on one girl, but the fact is sometimes there is one that just feels particularly right. Well I really blew this one after it was going quite well. But, I don't think it is completely lost. It is still quite early.

So here is the background: I am 51, she is about 33. I went through a coding bootcamp program then stayed on as an assistant for the next session. She was a student in that one. There were a number of attractive women in the group, but she is by far the most attractive. I was friendly, but professional with all of them. Since I was managing the student records I saw that she had put down a husband as her emergency contact. I would never mess up someone's marriage. That is just bad. But, I could still enjoy her company. I think that allowed me to be a little more relaxed and natural with her.

Things got interesting when, near the end of the course, like the first week of December, she, another guy and I went out for a drink and she mentioned that she had moved to the city and left all her stuff at her old place... and was staying with a friend... Of course that got the wheels turning in my head. Hmm, I am beginning to see where my mistake started. I knew she would need some time before she would really be ready to have a relationship again... Or that is something like what I thought.

Shortly after that I texted her asking if she would like to join me for a hike. She was receptive to it but was with friends and was not able to join that day. The next day was Monday and she was clearly happy to see me and happy that I had asked her to hike. That was just the first of many good interactions after finding out that she had left her husband. We exchanged emails over the Christmas break and talked about meeting up. We went to lunch on Jan. 5th. I was working on a project for the bootcamp company and she was starting her job search so we were both quite busy.

Things changed on January 27th… and somehow I didn’t really register the implications. Just thinking of it makes me feel sick. I was working on Friday evening in the computer lab and one of the guys from the group I had assisted was talking about going to dinner with a few others. I did not expect her, but she turned up and came over to me when she saw me. The whole evening went better and more easily that I could have even imagined. We just talked about what was at hand and going on in our lives, but I had her laughing a lot and it seemed like every story I told had a perfect combination of ups and downs. When we left for dinner I suggested that she could leave her backpack at the school as I was doing with mine. Throughout the dinner I was more engaged and entertaining for the whole group than I usually am. When it was done the group was walking back and everyone peeled off to go their various directions except her and I. I had a bit of nervousness about being alone with her, but here is where I made some grave error… Somehow I did not consciously register that this was the opportunity to take it to the next level. When we got back to our packs she started asking me things like if I would like to go for a run sometime or ride bikes in a particular place, more interest than she had been showing previously. We stood near the elevators for a while and I can recall, my mind was still on trying to build rapport. We hugged a couple times there. She then suggested that we go over to my bike, which was in a dimmer, more secluded area. I was getting ready to go and she was planning to continue studying for another couple hours. We hugged more there and somehow it still didn’t even occur to me to kiss her. Somehow I was just so stuck in this mode of rapport building, like I still had to give her space in consideration of her recently separated state. I thought I was handling it perfectly.

After this I was very happy with myself. Through the weekend I did not even realize how badly I had f’d up. I was eager to see her. We texted back and forth a bit. She was busy with studying for interviews. We finally met up on Wednesday, Feb. 1st and she was quite happy to see me, still laughing easily at things I said, clearly still rather thrilled to be with me. We went up on the roof of the building, which is a nice place to hang out with a view. It was another opportunity where I could have kissed her. She was still in state and ready, happy with me. I missed it. When I saw her on Friday I could sense a tension. Her big interview was on Monday. She did not want to do anything over the weekend. Somehow I had in my mind that I wanted to first get her to join me for a hike or something, then I would kiss her, like I needed to do it in a particular setting. The next week I was waiting for an interview call and ended up working from home all week, so I didn't see her in person. Finally, two weeks after that very nice Friday evening, I realized exactly how badly I had missed my opportunity.

I have been beating myself up pretty relentlessly over the weekend, but I managed to avoid sending her the message begging her to forgive me and give me another chance. She has seemed to become a little less responsive, but she is still always very nice. My women friends have all assured me that things are probably fine. The guys have confirmed my thoughts that I have probably hosed myself.

I did send a message saying, ‘Hi <>, Did I mess things up between us? I feel like I did. If so, I hope you can forgive me.’ She replied with, ‘Hi <>, there is nothing to worry about. Wish you the best for your interview tomorrow. Good luck!!’ So I have shown a bit of lack of confidence there, but that was pretty much it. On Valentine’s Day I sent her an e-card. It was not overly romantic or flowery or anything. The note I put in it said, ‘Dear <>, Just wanted to let you know that you are special to me and I appreciate you! I hope you have a happy day today! Love <>’ She replied with a, ‘Thank you, <>!’ I have not sent her anything since that on Tuesday morning. I have not seen her in person for over a week.

Hmm, Now as I retell it I am not feeling so bad. The strong emotions I was feeling in my chest were making me feel like it was totally ruined. It is hard to think rationally about how to handle this. I think that she is still open to me, but I am feeling really vulnerable now, especially when these emotions around having f’d it up arise. I was starting to get some feeling that she may have turned to some more action oriented guy. Somehow her decline in responsiveness was making me suspect that she may have started something with someone else. But really I probably shouldn’t worry about anything like that anyway. She has not explicitly told me anything like that. The main question is how to approach her going forward. My thinking is to see her in person, hopefully tomorrow, check her state, hopefully get her comfortable and maybe to laugh, then suggest we do something again. I have asked her to come with me for a hike a number of times and she has declined, so that feels a little overused. A mutual friend has suggested going kayaking and I am thinking that might be a good one to suggest. If we get out in nature somewhere I can make a move, if she is open to going at all. My biggest concern is over how nervous I might feel next time I see her. I have never been nervous with her. How do I build her anticipation and delight with me back up again? What sort of timing should I use?

Incidentally, I also have another girl who is incredibly hot that I will probably see tomorrow too. That is not as far along though. But I do have some other outlet for my interest. I also have another who I have already been to bed with a few times, but she is traveling for business for a couple months.

So, yeah, I guess I work slowly. I was divorced about a year ago and am not quite up to speed with this stuff again.

Interested to hear opinions. Hopefully from some with more experience that I have.

Thanks!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2017 2:29 pm 
Online
King Among Mortals
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2011 8:36 pm
Posts: 7074
Location: United States
Whats with all this hiking and kayaking?

1. Go to the bar. (near your place) Have her join you. Ask if she can cook. Tell her you have a guitar, or velvet Elvis collection at home. Ask her if she wants to see it. Bring her home. Sleep with her. Tell her it's your birthday in the morning. Enjoy your made with lust breakfast.

2. Tell her you are starting that new show on Netflix and grilling steaks and you have two nice T-bones and throwing one away would be terrible!

_________________
In the hands of the right man, a woman is a 100 different women, limited only by imagination and his willingness to make her feel safe and lead her.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2017 4:59 pm 
Offline
New to MPUA Forum

Joined: Sun May 29, 2016 8:29 pm
Posts: 7
Hahaha, Awesome. I love the suggestions. Thanks. It sets me back in control to have some good ideas. I feel better already.

The reason I like hiking is because it is a screen for women who are minimally active. Being active outdoors is a requirement to be part of my life. But I already know this girl is in good shape and active. Usually I go for inviting them to dinner at my place after the hiking date, so thanks for that. No need for me to wait any longer to invite her over, although I usually go for a kiss before that so I know that they are more likely to agree to the dinner. I think she is ready to come to my place. We will see!

Thanks!!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2017 5:19 pm 
Online
King Among Mortals
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2011 8:36 pm
Posts: 7074
Location: United States
Welcome.

Just don't overthink it, like that symposium I had to scroll through to get to the point, and you should be fine.

She's been waiting for dick since Christmas Bro, give her what she wants!

_________________
In the hands of the right man, a woman is a 100 different women, limited only by imagination and his willingness to make her feel safe and lead her.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2017 10:45 pm 
Offline
New to MPUA Forum

Joined: Sun May 29, 2016 8:29 pm
Posts: 7
Thanks again. I have been engaging with her a bit more and have not gotten enough in person time to escalate anything. She has been very slow to reply by text and I hesitate to propose any significant activity, like coming to my place, by text.

To recap, I completely stupidly missed an obvious opportunity to take it to the next level when she was showing clear interest. Now she is less responsive, seeming reluctant to get together or make plans. Any suggestions on how to intrigue her and build interest and excitement again via text or email? I know this is probably context specific to some degree. Perhaps I just need to drop it for a while? I feel like there has to be a more active approach that just letting it cool off, but it seems that if I am acting out of any sense of urgency then I am just killing it further.

Thanks.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2017 1:47 pm 
Online
King Among Mortals
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2011 8:36 pm
Posts: 7074
Location: United States
Manzan wrote:
I hesitate to propose any significant activity, like coming to my place, by text..


Why the hell not? That's what texting is for!

Quote:
I completely stupidly missed an obvious opportunity to take it to the next level when she was showing clear interest.


And you're doing it again! Being boring and mundane will get you nowhere.

Quote:
Any suggestions on how to intrigue her and build interest and excitement again via text?


Yes.

-"Every time I close my eyes…I see you naked…just so ya know…I'd like seeing you naked with my eyes open even more :D"

-"Hey wild thing….I was just thinking of you…instantly all my blood traveled south!"

-"I had a dream last night…all I can remember are those talented lips of yours."

Get creative.

Then an invite for Netflix and chill. BOOM.

_________________
In the hands of the right man, a woman is a 100 different women, limited only by imagination and his willingness to make her feel safe and lead her.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2017 6:32 pm 
Offline
Dedicated Member

Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2014 4:14 pm
Posts: 621
Manzan wrote:
Thanks again. I have been engaging with her a bit more and have not gotten enough in person time to escalate anything. She has been very slow to reply by text and I hesitate to propose any significant activity, like coming to my place, by text.

To recap, I completely stupidly missed an obvious opportunity to take it to the next level when she was showing clear interest. Now she is less responsive, seeming reluctant to get together or make plans. Any suggestions on how to intrigue her and build interest and excitement again via text or email? I know this is probably context specific to some degree. Perhaps I just need to drop it for a while? I feel like there has to be a more active approach that just letting it cool off, but it seems that if I am acting out of any sense of urgency then I am just killing it further.

Thanks.


No offense but think you need to rewire your whole system and the way you view relationships.

Starting with - meet NEW women, so you can get better at understanding them.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2017 7:45 pm 
Offline
New to MPUA Forum

Joined: Sun May 29, 2016 8:29 pm
Posts: 7
ChocolatePUA wrote:
No offense but think you need to rewire your whole system and the way you view relationships.

Starting with - meet NEW women, so you can get better at understanding them.


Hey, No offense taken! I have really been appreciating the input and perspective. I have not done much dating in a while and pretty much only online since I was divorced. I think the online thing has stunted my growth a little. It is easy to operate with a very limited approach online and be reasonably successful. I think I maybe should focus less on the online thing if I ever want to grow.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2017 9:54 pm 
Offline
New to MPUA Forum

Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2017 9:48 pm
Posts: 5
It's fine to review your mistakes but the level of detail and emotion in the OP post suggest a case of

oneitis

I found several threads here on "oneitis: symptoms, treatment".

general-questions/this-oneitis-vt194767.html

general-questions/topic-vt200052.html

Do you agree with the diagnosis?

_________________
You may not know why you are beating your wife.
But she knows why!
-Arab Saying


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 3:54 am 
Offline
New to MPUA Forum

Joined: Sun May 29, 2016 8:29 pm
Posts: 7
omm0910 wrote:
It's fine to review your mistakes but the level of detail and emotion in the OP post suggest a case of

oneitis

I found several threads here on "oneitis: symptoms, treatment".

general-questions/this-oneitis-vt194767.html

general-questions/topic-vt200052.html

Do you agree with the diagnosis?


Dude, Thanks for looking up my post. But that is not really any help at all. We all know what it feels like and no matter what you call it it is a learning opportunity. You and I have been over this already. Slapping a label on me is not going to help.

Personally I want to live with passion; to be able to experience strong emotion and still operate effectively, when it is going well or not so well. So here I am. Strong emotion is present, check. I would say it is the fool who would turn his back and try to ignore those strong emotions. I am not sending her loads of desperate texts, or leaving voicemails. I have a few other girls in the pipeline, one regular who is just out of town, one incredibly hot who is still just a possibility. My situation overall is pretty good, but I can recognize this girl as someone worth fighting for to keep in my life. Situations like this where you are motivated to fight are the ones where you may grow if you do not just throw up your hands and say 'Oneitis!' When do YOU give up? When do you keep fighting? When do you feel you are done and can learn no more from a situation? Well, it has not come to that for me. I don't think it has for her yet either.

It may be true that the best route for me is to let it sit for a while, but then how long is a while? Certainly texting more than once a day is not letting it sit. Letting it sit two weeks is probably longer than necessary. Is once a day too often? how do you calibrate such things? It becomes difficult to gauge things like this when motions become stronger. When I am feeling confident and in control then it is easy to do at least some semblance of the right thing. The funny thing in this case was that I felt like I was doing the right thing. I was very happy with how things were going. Then I realized that I had completely missed it. That is what threw me.

Confidence is slowly returning, but it has been difficult. It has been very helpful to hear from Heywood a healthier way to think about this. And fortunately, his approach is similar enough to mine that I can see the path forward again. Have fun with it. Be creative and playful. Just fucking ask for what you want. Then let go. Give it another try later. Give it a try with someone else. repeat.

That said, I have certainly encountered a place for my personal growth. When I saw this girl seeming to pull away from me it fucking snapped me into a different state! This leads to a question that I have come back to since I was quite young: How do you deal with strong emotions when they arise? I think this is pretty central to getting better at interacting with women and I suspect it varies for different people. For example psychopaths do not feel emotion so they are not hindered by it. Something like 5% of people are psychopaths, but I would not want to be one. One tried and true approach to improving in situations that bring up strong emotions is simply to repeat them. Like I do not get much if any stage fright now when I stand up to speak in front of a crowd. For me, I get the best results if I am prepared, and brave. One thing I have learned from the public speaking is that people can rarely tell that you are nervous, so just keep present to the surroundings and keep executing towards your vision.

Anyway, just some thoughts. If things go to plan I will resolve this by the end of the week.

Thanks guys!


Last edited by Manzan on Wed Feb 22, 2017 12:24 am, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 3:08 pm 
Offline
Dedicated Member

Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2014 4:14 pm
Posts: 621
Manzan wrote:
ChocolatePUA wrote:
No offense but think you need to rewire your whole system and the way you view relationships.

Starting with - meet NEW women, so you can get better at understanding them.


Hey, No offense taken! I have really been appreciating the input and perspective. I have not done much dating in a while and pretty much only online since I was divorced. I think the online thing has stunted my growth a little. It is easy to operate with a very limited approach online and be reasonably successful. I think I maybe should focus less on the online thing if I ever want to grow.


Hey Manzan,

Think of women/relationships as a stock market investment: At the end of the day, you want to make sure your money (emotional, physical, monetary, time investment) is placed in a stock (a woman, or women) who will best benefit you.

What you have done (and many, many men before you) is to over invest in a stock that has little chance of investment. What's going to happen (trust me, it will happen) is that you end up overinvesting in this woman, not getting your returns, and then end up being upset at your lost investment.

What you SHOULD be doing is cautiously investing in several stocks, waiting to see which one performs profitably, then slowly and cautiously increasing your investment.

The ONLY way you can truly know how good your returns are going to be are to invest something. This means you MUST date other women to get a better sense of who they are, and how to deal with women in general. When you have gotten up to speed, then you can really begin to feel out which ones are worth your time and energy.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 4:08 pm 
Online
King Among Mortals
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2011 8:36 pm
Posts: 7074
Location: United States
Quote:
How do you deal with strong emotions when they arise?


The 'emotion' you're referring to is rejection or the fear of it.
The fear of rejection is an irrational fear that has you convinced that women won't accept you for one or more reasons. Maybe you fear that they won't accept your opinions, values, beliefs or behavior.

But it's just bullshit. It's all in your head.

How do you get past it?

Dump out your bag of fucks, so that you have very few fucks left to give. That way you'll only give a fuck, when you really REALLY need to.

Say or do anything you feel with a woman. The ones that react positively, continue, the ones that react negatively, DON"T give a fuck, just move on.

_________________
In the hands of the right man, a woman is a 100 different women, limited only by imagination and his willingness to make her feel safe and lead her.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 10:52 pm 
Offline
New to MPUA Forum

Joined: Sun May 29, 2016 8:29 pm
Posts: 7
Heywood Jablowme wrote:
Quote:
How do you deal with strong emotions when they arise?


The 'emotion' you're referring to is rejection or the fear of it.
The fear of rejection is an irrational fear that has you convinced that women won't accept you for one or more reasons. Maybe you fear that they won't accept your opinions, values, beliefs or behavior.

But it's just bullshit. It's all in your head.

How do you get past it?

Dump out your bag of fucks, so that you have very few fucks left to give. That way you'll only give a fuck, when you really REALLY need to.

Say or do anything you feel with a woman. The ones that react positively, continue, the ones that react negatively, DON"T give a fuck, just move on.


Awesome. You called it. Suddenly I felt like I had something to lose, or may already have lost something and felt vulnerable to losing further. Yes, rejection. And my brain is totally out of whack. I think I mainly have a hard time forgiving myself for my mistake and it is not really as messed up as I had thought, or that important in the long run. Dumping my bag of fucks here, thank you. Realistically she is probably still pretty open to me anyway.

I came across an interesting post by Tim Ferriss with an excerpt from the recent Tony Robbins book that sort of hits home on some of this. Check it out here - http://tim.blog/2017/02/20/tony-robbins-how-to-suffer-less-and-invest-intelligently/. It is all about your focus. Do you consistently bring your focus back to what makes you happy? Even when I am down about things that may have happened I enjoy the hell out of figuring them out and know that I will experience happiness again in the near future.

I think you are right that I have been experiencing fear of rejection, but it is mixed with a thrill of anticipation that something good might happen as well. even that alone can make it difficult to calibrate and make the right decisions, especially about timing.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 12:21 am 
Offline
New to MPUA Forum

Joined: Sun May 29, 2016 8:29 pm
Posts: 7
ChocolatePUA wrote:
Think of women/relationships as a stock market investment: At the end of the day, you want to make sure your money (emotional, physical, monetary, time investment) is placed in a stock (a woman, or women) who will best benefit you.

What you have done (and many, many men before you) is to over invest in a stock that has little chance of investment. What's going to happen (trust me, it will happen) is that you end up overinvesting in this woman, not getting your returns, and then end up being upset at your lost investment.

What you SHOULD be doing is cautiously investing in several stocks, waiting to see which one performs profitably, then slowly and cautiously increasing your investment.

The ONLY way you can truly know how good your returns are going to be are to invest something. This means you MUST date other women to get a better sense of who they are, and how to deal with women in general. When you have gotten up to speed, then you can really begin to feel out which ones are worth your time and energy.


Wow, I like it. Makes sense. Seems to be a good model for managing progress in risky endeavors. A friend of mine used to talk about his model, that dating is like fishing - you throw out some bait and wait for a nibble. This is great, but how do you think about it after the first bite?

Not sure I can quite make sense of my fuck up here with it. I was a bit over invested since I had been investing a small amount over such a long time. But it wouldn't have been a problem if I had just acted appropriately when the door opened. She was right there with me, but then I left her hanging and didn't act. Oh well. We will see how it plays out. In the mean time I will work on my other investments!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2017 7:31 pm 
Offline
New to MPUA Forum

Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2017 9:48 pm
Posts: 5
I'm actually friends with Manzen IRL and he called me on it. Hopefully he'll be back here soon but just to keep the thread alive, yesterday he...

1. emailed her to invite her over for dinner
(no reply for 2 hours)
2. texted her
(no reply for 2 hours)
3. texted her again
(no reply for 2 hours)
4. texted her apologizing
(no reply, but whatever system he was using he knows she read the text)

I'm hoping that after the dust has cleared he can look back through all the fine words and noble reasoning he discussed with me, and posted above, all the Tony Robbins and Tim Ferris. As he said himself, of course we want to examine in fine detail our experiences, so we can learn from them. While there is some truth in all he said, my main take was that he was rationalizing his obsession and oneitis, using straw man arguments, keeping his fond illusions alive, trying to prove that he had control and could bring her around.

Quote:
This was published today. Take it with a grain of salt. But I generally like Troy's wisdom.

http://www.returnofkings.com/115393/how ... e-with-you

He mentions the DABDA theory about grieving.

Probably Troy's anger theory is not going to wash. I think though he's right to bring up DABDA. Which is pretty common for traumatic events, not just terminal cancer diagnoses, to include breakups, divorces, loss, unrequited love.

Another approach men use is kind of the opposite. To say to the woman "thank you for holding me to a higher standard. I am not worthy. But with your feedback I will strive to be worthy."

... "now take me back we are soulmates!" (ok joking here, its still over.) So then what does worthy mean. My view: being clingy, and letting your thoughts and fantasies get out of control, is just not on, with any woman, or with life in general, ever. So to be grateful for her holding the line and teaching you that. But at the same time she's over for you, don't kid yourself or her.


Our brother is hurting friends. We share his pain. We've all been there. But he has to learn from this and we can't do it for him. As the Chinese saying goes "it is the good medicine that tastes bitter" (referring to advice and learning experience, not just chinese herb decoctions).

My goal here is not to be right, or to cockblock, but to keep him from hurting himself (again). I think most of us saw this train wreck coming a mile away.

_________________
You may not know why you are beating your wife.
But she knows why!
-Arab Saying


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 18 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to: