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 Post subject: Good first date, then...
PostPosted: Sun Nov 13, 2016 7:35 pm 
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I had a good first date with a chick that I met at a bar last week. Kissed her halfway through the date, we had drinks, then went to play bowling, escalated physical touching, kissing, etc. Then of course, I kissed her at the end of the date.

I texted her the next morning, she was responding positively, with smileys, saying she had a good time, etc. So we texted back and forth for a few days, and yesterday I told her that I wanted to challenge her at something else than bowling since she was pretty bad at it, and she responded "As long as it isn't bowling!:)"

So I was like ok, this is looking pretty positive, so I answered back that I'd like to challenge her to a game of pool this week. She didn't answer for 3+ hours which is unlike her, then she finally answered that she had a lot going on in her life right now (one of her close friends died recently), and that she doesn't think that she's ready to date just yet, and that I shouldn't take it personally because she had an awesome time with me. I'm like ok wtf.... why did she wait 3+ days after the first date to tell me this??

Anyways, I've dated hundreds of times in my life, and this is the first time that I get this type of rejection after a first date where I kissed the girl. This never, ever happened! The only negative thing that I can think of our first date, is that at the end of the date, before the final kiss, I told her "So hopefully I'll see you soon?" which I thought came off as needy but I kissed her immediately after saying it, so I don't think that this could be a deal breaker.

Did this ever happen to any of you experienced guys out there? Any clue what I may have fucked up?

Thanks


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 13, 2016 8:27 pm 
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I could be wrong, but there are stereotypes associated with every sport. Bowling seems clean, fun, family-oriented, harmless. Everyone does it.

When last did you see a movie where a sweet, cute girl went into a dark pool room and had it out with all the drinking, cigarette-smoking guys?

I'm not saying this is what your girlfriend thought. However my first thought was, "Oh, so that's how he really sees me...", or "Does he think I'm one of his guy friends?" lol. Think about the stereotype associated with girls who play pool with guys? The tough and somewhat "dirty" tomboy. Compare this to bowling. Everyone likes bowling. Even valley girls aren't opposed to bowling.

I'll guess you didn't pay attention to the kind of girl you were dating. But these are all my assumptions, of course. To give you a good possible answer. You scared her off with a sport that is generally stereotyped as seedy and, well, masculine.

[edit]

-She clearly indicated that she didn't enjoy the bowling "challenge" so why "challenge" her to do an even more difficult activity? (pool)
-She doesn't want to be "challenged" when she goes out with you


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 13, 2016 10:17 pm 
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I could be wrong, but there are stereotypes associated with every sport. Bowling seems clean, fun, family-oriented, harmless. Everyone does it.

When last did you see a movie where a sweet, cute girl went into a dark pool room and had it out with all the drinking, cigarette-smoking guys?

I'm not saying this is what your girlfriend thought. However my first thought was, "Oh, so that's how he really sees me...", or "Does he think I'm one of his guy friends?" lol. Think about the stereotype associated with girls who play pool with guys? The tough and somewhat "dirty" tomboy. Compare this to bowling. Everyone likes bowling. Even valley girls aren't opposed to bowling.

I'll guess you didn't pay attention to the kind of girl you were dating. But these are all my assumptions, of course. To give you a good possible answer. You scared her off with a sport that is generally stereotyped as seedy and, well, masculine.

[edit]

-She clearly indicated that she didn't enjoy the bowling "challenge" so why "challenge" her to do an even more difficult activity? (pool)
-She doesn't want to be "challenged" when she goes out with you
I was only teasing her with the challenge though, I just wanted to do something fun with her lol... Thanks for your input, you might be right since she seemed responsive until I proposed going for pool:/


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2016 3:19 am 
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Anyways, I've dated hundreds of times in my life, and this is the first time that I get this type of rejection after a first date where I kissed the girl.
No you didn't date hundreds of women or you would know that things like these happen all the time.

And you wouldn't care either.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2016 4:19 am 
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Anyways, I've dated hundreds of times in my life, and this is the first time that I get this type of rejection after a first date where I kissed the girl.
No you didn't date hundreds of women or you would know that things like these happen all the time.

And you wouldn't care either.

I said hundreds of dates, not hundreds of women. I meant that I went on hundreds of dates with numerous women. But yes, in my many years of dating, when I kiss the girl on the first date, there's always been a second date. This is why I'm kind of shocked right now.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2016 8:54 am 
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However my first thought was, "Oh, so that's how he really sees me...", or "Does he think I'm one of his guy friends?" lol. Think about the stereotype associated with girls who play pool with guys? The tough and somewhat "dirty" tomboy. Compare this to bowling. Everyone likes bowling. Even valley girls aren't opposed to bowling.
So a guy inviting you to play pool speaks on how he "really" sees you. Because you've had a grand total of one date, so he clearly has an in depth overview of who you are.
That's such a ridiculous train of thought.

Anyway, OP, she is right to some degree. A bowling date is fun and not a bad idea for a first date. Also something most people are willing to at least try out. Pool on the other had.. not so much.
Aside from that, what's next? Ping pong date?

There was no problem with you teasing her, and you did fine all around. But keep in mind what works best for women is emotional stimulation. And often times the best way to do that is over a drink in a nice place.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2016 3:00 pm 
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However my first thought was, "Oh, so that's how he really sees me...", or "Does he think I'm one of his guy friends?" lol. Think about the stereotype associated with girls who play pool with guys? The tough and somewhat "dirty" tomboy. Compare this to bowling. Everyone likes bowling. Even valley girls aren't opposed to bowling.
So a guy inviting you to play pool speaks on how he "really" sees you. Because you've had a grand total of one date, so he clearly has an in depth overview of who you are.
That's such a ridiculous train of thought.

Anyway, OP, she is right to some degree. A bowling date is fun and not a bad idea for a first date. Also something most people are willing to at least try out. Pool on the other had.. not so much.
Aside from that, what's next? Ping pong date?

There was no problem with you teasing her, and you did fine all around. But keep in mind what works best for women is emotional stimulation. And often times the best way to do that is over a drink in a nice place.
Thanks, just to be more precise: I started the first date at a nice bar, then we moved to the bowling joint after an hour of nice conversation.

I thought suggesting another drink for a second date wouldn't be original so that's why I suggested pool. What would be a good second date in your opinion?


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2016 3:52 pm 
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So a guy inviting you to play pool speaks on how he "really" sees you. Because you've had a grand total of one date, so he clearly has an in depth overview of who you are.
That's such a ridiculous train of thought.
Let's not pretend that people don't form "first impressions" the minute they meet each other? It doesn't have to be in-depth, and it definitely doesn't have to be accurate. Clearly, if you invite me to go play pool with you and some guys, you have already assumed I am the type of girl to enjoy this activity. And the SPAM associated with this activity. And you think I fit in with one or more of the stereotypes associated with this activity. You should be able to see this.

But what's most important is: precisely because you think my train of thought is ridiculous, it would never have occurred to you as a possible explanation! I think I helped OP here with an actual explanation, since he seems well-meaning. It's a better explanation than "Girls flake all the time, who cares why."


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2016 4:16 pm 
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In the past I actually used to diversify my dating activities, but overtime I came to the conclusion that it's largely unnecessary.

What it all comes down to is substance. First date being an activity date is cool. Get that connection going while also having something to do in the background to keep it light and fun.

But here's the thing. Dating is about getting to know the person you're supposedly into. The activity is simply the means to that end.
So if her decision to either accept or refuse an invite is more influenced by the activity rather than by your presence, that simply means she's not that into you. Whether that's because you fucked up the first date or because of external reasons out of your control is not very relevant at this point.

Focus on content, not context. She only needs one reason to get out of the house - and that's you.

All that said, drinks are as good as anything else. What I adamantly stay away from is movie or dinner. Unless they're at my house. Which are usually my 2nd or 3rd date options.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2016 4:47 pm 
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Let's not pretend that people don't form "first impressions" the minute they meet each other? It doesn't have to be in-depth, and it definitely doesn't have to be accurate. Clearly, if you invite me to go play pool with you and some guys, you have already assumed I am the type of girl to enjoy this activity. And the SPAM associated with this activity. And you think I fit in with one or more of the stereotypes associated with this activity. You should be able to see this.
Sure they form impressions. But as far as pool goes, I'm inviting you. Not you and some guys. It's a date, there's no guys.
But more importantly, as is with bowling, I'm not inviting you because I associate you with that activity, because I think you're the type to enjoy bowling or because I think you fit a certain stereotype. That has nothing to do with it.
I'm inviting you because I like it, and you either have never tried it and may be curious, have tried it and enjoy or have tried it and don't enjoy.
And if you don't, you can just say so. That's normal.

What's not normal is taking offense as if he just indirectly made you out to be a tomboy and completely shutting him down.
Quote:
But what's most important is: precisely because you think my train of thought is ridiculous, it would never have occurred to you as a possible explanation! I think I helped OP here with an actual explanation, since he seems well-meaning. It's a better explanation than "Girls flake all the time, who cares why."
Another ridiculous explanation would be that her cat died and now she's sad.
Here's a better explanation.
Quote:
But here's the thing. Dating is about getting to know the person you're supposedly into. The activity is simply the means to that end.
So if her decision to either accept or refuse an invite is more influenced by the activity rather than by your presence, that simply means she's not that into you. Whether that's because you fucked up the first date or because of external reasons out of your control is not very relevant at this point.

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There's no such thing as shit-tests.
How to keep a girl.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2016 5:11 pm 
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In the past I actually used to diversify my dating activities, but overtime I came to the conclusion that it's largely unnecessary.

What it all comes down to is substance. First date being an activity date is cool. Get that connection going while also having something to do in the background to keep it light and fun.

But here's the thing. Dating is about getting to know the person you're supposedly into. The activity is simply the means to that end.
So if her decision to either accept or refuse an invite is more influenced by the activity rather than by your presence, that simply means she's not that into you. Whether that's because you fucked up the first date or because of external reasons out of your control is not very relevant at this point.

Focus on content, not context. She only needs one reason to get out of the house - and that's you.

All that said, drinks are as good as anything else. What I adamantly stay away from is movie or dinner. Unless they're at my house. Which are usually my 2nd or 3rd date options.
Yeah, that's what I thought. I probably fucked up something, I'm thinking it's when I said "Hopefully I'll see you soon?", I remember that felt awkward and when I left her, I felt awkward too because I was overthinking about the fact that I had just said that needy line.

Anyways, what's weird is that she was responding positively the next day, so I thought she would be willing to go on a second date 100% for sure. Yikes...


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2016 5:12 pm 
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So a guy inviting you to play pool speaks on how he "really" sees you. Because you've had a grand total of one date, so he clearly has an in depth overview of who you are.
That's such a ridiculous train of thought.
Let's not pretend that people don't form "first impressions" the minute they meet each other? It doesn't have to be in-depth, and it definitely doesn't have to be accurate. Clearly, if you invite me to go play pool with you and some guys, you have already assumed I am the type of girl to enjoy this activity. And the SPAM associated with this activity. And you think I fit in with one or more of the stereotypes associated with this activity. You should be able to see this.

But what's most important is: precisely because you think my train of thought is ridiculous, it would never have occurred to you as a possible explanation! I think I helped OP here with an actual explanation, since he seems well-meaning. It's a better explanation than "Girls flake all the time, who cares why."
I just want to be clear here: I never invited other people for our second date, it was only me and her.


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2016 6:03 pm 
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I just want to be clear here: I never invited other people for our second date, it was only me and her.
Okay. But my reply was all about stereotypes and norms. Generally, you don't just have 2 people in a pool room. I think it's a great decision on your part not to have other people there. But she would probably assume it's a regular pool place. With oother people around. Just like with bowling - there are generally other people around. I guess there really was a communication problem as well. She probably made 1000 assumptions since you didn't really give details.
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What's not normal is taking offense as if he just indirectly made you out to be a tomboy and completely shutting him down.
Well, who knows what she thought? We're all just guessing here. She probably thought exactly what I thought :)
Quote:
Another ridiculous explanation would be that her cat died and now she's sad.
Here's a better explanation.
Quote:
But here's the thing. Dating is about getting to know the person you're supposedly into. The activity is simply the means to that end.
So if her decision to either accept or refuse an invite is more influenced by the activity rather than by your presence, that simply means she's not that into you. Whether that's because you fucked up the first date or because of external reasons out of your control is not very relevant at this point.
The activity helps her figure what the guy is like - and what he thinks of her.

Again, this is all speculation. Because her behavior was unexpected and surprised the OP. I can offer so many reasons and so many things she may have assumed. If she's not looking for a potential husband, then she shut him down because pool is unappealing. If she is looking for a husband, then a guy who wants to play game after game is clearly not good enough. I'm just thinking of several possible reasons for her behavior. Because I find it intriguing. Especially since she didn't reply for 3 whole days? She probably found the text too overwhelming to deal with immediately and just decided to pick it up again when she was in the mood to "deal with it". All of this is extremely interesting to consider.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 24, 2016 4:25 am 
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I just want to be clear here: I never invited other people for our second date, it was only me and her.
Okay. But my reply was all about stereotypes and norms. Generally, you don't just have 2 people in a pool room. I think it's a great decision on your part not to have other people there. But she would probably assume it's a regular pool place. With oother people around. Just like with bowling - there are generally other people around. I guess there really was a communication problem as well. She probably made 1000 assumptions since you didn't really give details.
Quote:
What's not normal is taking offense as if he just indirectly made you out to be a tomboy and completely shutting him down.
Well, who knows what she thought? We're all just guessing here. She probably thought exactly what I thought :)
Quote:
Another ridiculous explanation would be that her cat died and now she's sad.
Here's a better explanation.
Quote:
But here's the thing. Dating is about getting to know the person you're supposedly into. The activity is simply the means to that end.
So if her decision to either accept or refuse an invite is more influenced by the activity rather than by your presence, that simply means she's not that into you. Whether that's because you fucked up the first date or because of external reasons out of your control is not very relevant at this point.
The activity helps her figure what the guy is like - and what he thinks of her.

Again, this is all speculation. Because her behavior was unexpected and surprised the OP. I can offer so many reasons and so many things she may have assumed. If she's not looking for a potential husband, then she shut him down because pool is unappealing. If she is looking for a husband, then a guy who wants to play game after game is clearly not good enough. I'm just thinking of several possible reasons for her behavior. Because I find it intriguing. Especially since she didn't reply for 3 whole days? She probably found the text too overwhelming to deal with immediately and just decided to pick it up again when she was in the mood to "deal with it". All of this is extremely interesting to consider.

Sorry I think I wasn't clear: she did reply during those 3 days, we had some casual conversations during that time and I thought that everything was going fine, until I invited her to the second date. Then, she didn't reply for hours and hit me with the surprising text.

By the way, what do you think about the fact that the date ended awkwardly? I did kiss her at the end of the date, but I felt awkward because of the dumb thing I said (I'll see you soon hopefully?). You think a girl could consider this as a deal breaker even though the rest of the date was almost perfect?

And I don't think that she was looking for a husband as she's 22 and I live in a very liberal city.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 30, 2016 5:21 am 
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By the way, what do you think about the fact that the date ended awkwardly? I did kiss her at the end of the date, but I felt awkward because of the dumb thing I said (I'll see you soon hopefully?). You think a girl could consider this as a deal breaker even though the rest of the date was almost perfect?

And I don't think that she was looking for a husband as she's 22 and I live in a very liberal city.
All of these different conspiracy theories about what you might've done or said wrong! Dude..maybe it was just as simple as she went on a couple of dates with you, and she realized that you just wasn't her type. It happens! You could've done everything right and the end result would've still been the same. This shit happens with alot of the girls that i meet too. It's called "natural chemistry". Some girls you just don't have "natural chemistry" with, and no matter what you do, she still will flake on you.


The same thing happens when you confidently approach a random girl via cold approach..you feel like things is going well with the girl, and you still get blown out or flaked anyway. It is what it is. It's part of the game. Every girl is not going to like you for you.


I would just focus on sexually and emotionally spiking the girls that you cold approach, and the girls that you go out on dates with, as much as humanly possible. That way, even if you're not necessarily her type..you can still get her into bed with you. Since you're still not her type, she may just decide to hit it and quit it. But at least you fucked her. And that's cool too. You may not end up in a relationship with a girl that doesn't consider you to be her type..but you can still spike her up enough to get her to want to sleep with you, and that will be it. The girl will put back on her clothes, she will bounce and be gone forever! Never to be seen again! Accept that as a reality of the game, when you're picking up some of these chicks. Focus on spiking them to sex, instead of trying to sweep every girl off of her feet, with the perfect date or the perfect pickup.


-G

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